Members of Congress, Justices of the Supreme Court, and especially my sister and fellow Americans, Today I instructed my Treasury Secretary and the chairwoman of the FDIC to begin the process of taking temporary receivership of the 19 largest banks in this country. These banks are currently insolvent and no amount of government stimulus or bailout funds can make them whole again. Prolonging the anxiety of Main Street as well as Wall Street by proposing short-term fixes to a systemic crisis has not worked and we will not continue the failed policy of quick-fix bandaid solutions that aim to reassure short-term investors by offering them short-lived confidence instead of the long-term security our economy and our citizens deserve.
We saw what happened when Lehman Brothers was allowed to crash land into bankruptcy and we will NOT let that happen again to our economy.
The FDIC has a long and stellar record of walking failed banks through receivership so that deposits are safe, assets are protected, and careful, necessary lending can resume. In fact, at this very moment Chairwoman Bair and the regional FDIC’s are resuscitating no fewer than 40 regional banks across the country.
Reckless deregulation, feckless lending, and a near-criminal lack of oversight by the supposed stewards of our financial system brought us to this point and those three causes also make the solution both obvious and necessary.
We must and we will:
- Rewrite iron-clad regulations on how banks operate.
- Reinstitute scrupulous lending standards.
- Reinvigorate our oversight bodies, especially the Securities and Exchange Commission and the board of banks overseers.
The traders, analysts, and investment experts who run Wall Street are some of the most brilliant people in the world. Smart, fearless, and intensely focused, they have created immense amounts of wealth for their investors, themselves, as well as for workers and regular Americans over the past 25 years. But they flew too close to the sun and the reckless exuberance of too many of them went unchecked. The disastrous results are there for anyone to see on the tickers and on the 24-hour cable news channels.
You may not WANT to face the fact of a decade of paper wealth up in smoke; I may not want to face that fact, but face it we must and face it we will.
There is no reason to worry that Wall Street won’t recover. As I said earlier, the men and women who make Wall Street tick are some of the smartest and fearless people on Earth. They WILL work in the new environment because flexibility, adaptive, creative thinking, and swift response to changing conditions is WHAT THEY EXCEL AT. It is why they are wealthy and why people with capital choose to hand it over to them to make it grow.
What’s hurting the financial markets most today is uncertainty about which direction the government plans to take. Tonight we put an end to that uncertainty, and tomorrow Wall Street will wake up and get back to work. They’re Americans and they are innovators — that’s what they DO.
For homeowners who are facing foreclosure, we will do what we can to help you and your families, but we cannot solve all of your problems. In areas hardest hit by the collapse of inflated home values, there will continue to be people who cannot afford their mortgage payments anymore and many of them will lose their homes to foreclosure. But we can, we must, and we will do everything we can to prevent this where we can and to soften the blow where we can’t.
To these ends, we will:
- Institute an across the board freeze on foreclosures while the FDIC completes the transfer of operations from the CEO’s of the major banks. However, a freeze on foreclosures does not mean a moratorium on paying your mortgage. If you don’t continue to make monthly payments, you will be expected to pay the past due amounts eventually, and if you can’t you may lose your home.
- Allow every American who currently has a mortgage and meets income requirements to refinance with a federally-backed, conforming loan at 5% interest.
- Make it illegal for foreclosures to be recorded on consumer credit reports after five years.
These measures will relieve some of the anxiety that so many millions of Americans are feeling today. A universal and unpleasant sense of distrust has crept into all of our civic relationships. Neighbors are feeling stingy about “bailing out the other guy” while their own ship may be sinking. Distrust of financial leaders, politicians, and the media has never been higher, and this incipient suspicion can easily become a toxic agent that tears at the fabric of unity and common purpose which connects all Americans to each other. That social and civic fabric of national unity has rarely appeared more fragile and prone to rending than it does today, and continuing to wear and tear at the basic trust which is necessary to bind ALL Americans, rich or poor, struggling or secure, to each other is perilously reckless. It is an outcome to be dreaded and avoided at all costs.
Tonight I am asking ALL Americans, and especially YOU members of Congress here in this hall, to help us regain and rebuild our trust in one another so that we can work together again as citizens, public servants, elected officials, and industry leaders. Not with words and vows. This will never be accomplished with grand speeches or pretty promises of faith. Only actions will work.
Our work, ALL of our work, from the Senate chambers to the boardrooms to the Oval Office, must be done with integrity. It must be predicated by manifested principles of fairness, clean dealing, and transparency. Patience, planning, and perseverance are what is necessary for America today, and Americans — all of you and all of us — must start practicing them now. Anything less will shortly lead us to ruin, and we will have no one to blame but ourselves.
Thank you, good night and good blessings on America.
{ 252 comments… read them below or add one }
invalidresponse 02.25.09 at 12:28 am
HOLY SHIT MURPHY….
If that actually came out of his mouth I would have stood up and clapped my hands..then I would have been the woman that fainted on the front row..
goofsmom 02.25.09 at 12:45 am
Love, Love, Love it…
I’m with invalid… I would have passed straight out….
P.S. Murphy did you get my mail?
Puma-SF 02.25.09 at 12:47 am
I just like to say that you are fucking awesome, Murphy. Man, I wish I could hug you right now.
KerryLINY 02.25.09 at 12:52 am
Wow murphy. You are on fire. And great writing. I am not sure the rest of the country is ready for this truth though and I’m almost pretty sure republicans would have been up in arms and might nearly foment a revolt. As it stands they seem to be reservedly like the presented version of the ‘sotu’.
I think they see the numbers and this truth internally too and for the first time inserted the idea that more bailout will be needed. There was also a side statement that the banks will NOT be allowed to fail. Things must be worse than the story they are rationing out.
Puma-SF 02.25.09 at 12:54 am
I really don’t know all the rules but this is so brilliant I’m going to cross post it.
Puma-SF 02.25.09 at 1:03 am
I’m worried about protectionism. He keeps saying it. I’m sure something bad is going to happen now.
turndownobama 02.25.09 at 1:30 am
Murphy,
When in the world did you have time to write THAT??? It’s great!
KerryLINY 02.25.09 at 1:31 am
I suspect another huge transfer of wealth is about to take place from the poor to the rich. BO and his cronies have talked the DOW down to about 7000 (I am not sure our economy is only worth its 1997 price apart from bank stocks) and many including my grandmother finally dumped her remaining stocks to huge losses.
Now BO trots out Bernanke to start talking things up and does a fake sotu with the same trend. I wont be surprised if the rich who have the capital swoop in and buy most of American stock for half the price of a year ago. I’ve seen predictions the market is going down tommorrow but I wont be surprised if the opposite happens. This whole thing might be a huge rip off in a year. I wish I knew what was going to really happen next or what the whole truth really is.
clintondemocrat 02.25.09 at 1:32 am
hahahahaha, oh my god, im on a fucking roller coaster ride from hell that left the station from the College Democrats National Convention in 2007 and won’t stop and won’t let me off.
that is how I feel. I just responded to an email that made me want to puke.
clintondemocrat 02.25.09 at 1:34 am
Do you know what BO could do for me? He could do one thing and one thing only: he could
LOWER MY STAFFORD LOANS TO 1990S INTEREST RATES WHICH WOULD CUT THE RATE IN HALF!!! IN HALF!!! IN HALF!!! HOW THE HELL AM I PAYING DOUBLE ON STAFFORD LOANS IN THIS ECONOMY??????????????????????????????????????
clintondemocrat 02.25.09 at 1:40 am
Oh my god, Im just going to have a freaking kiniption (spell?) fit.
I was going to bed two hours ago. Im going now. I don’t want anymore:
- emails from Ms. Obamite
- emails from my party chair
- emails from LH
- emails fighting over the fact that our new illustrious state party treasurer is a republican
- emails explaining to me that we have to be “open” (hey the Republicans just kicked the speaker of our state house out of their party for getting all 49 Democrats to join him to elect himself into the speakership 50-49).
I swear to god after getting attacked in the newspaper on friday, AGAIN over my comment of “voting present” but we’re just supposed to be so happy that a Republican contributor and voter is over our party treasury, Im at my wits end.
Im at my wits end with money and power.
I know, im not giving a lot of detail. Im trying to continue to protect my identity. I just couldn’t deal with it, if someone figured who I was right now.
I need some FREAKING PEACE for 15 bleeping hours.
clintondemocrat 02.25.09 at 1:43 am
BTW I saw a shot of Hillary tonight. She looked fabulous walking in and then she just looked like she needed to go to bed.
Go to bed Hillary!! I’m putting my foot down, go to bed Hillary.
Im going to bed too.
goofsmom 02.25.09 at 1:44 am
(((clintondem)))
I’ll keep you in my thoughts, tonight please rest…
Cinie 02.25.09 at 2:47 am
Murphy, you brilliantly elucidated what he could have said, while I was hammishly paraphrasing what he did say. Guess we both saw through to the fact that he didn’t really say much at all.
nhforhillary 02.25.09 at 4:17 am
Awesome writing Murphy.
Notyoursweetie 02.25.09 at 5:49 am
But why bother? he was reaganesque – before he even opened his mouth
http://edgeoforever.wordpress.com/2009/02/25/the-mediagasm-on-yet-another-bestest-speech/
Stray Yellar Dawg 02.25.09 at 6:04 am
Yes, if he’d have said THAT we’d all be applauding.
The good news this morning is….
http://syd4.blogspot.com/2009/02/what-happens-if-bobby-jindal-bombs.html
Palin stock soared overnight!
Lin4Hill 02.25.09 at 7:01 am
Murphy – I nominate you for president. This amazing post is right on the money. I have colleagues who comment that if we leave this economy to crash and burn without too many victims, it will reemerge just from the will of the people–but I’m not so sure about that, because evil has a way of filling in the cracks. We need the crash, but we also need daring leadership that isn’t afraid of offending their rich-corrupt supporters. Those smoke-filled rooms with America’s aristocrats wheeling and dealing have brought us to this brink.
HP Boston 02.25.09 at 7:44 am
Magnifico! Bravo Murphy! You makes us proud PUMAS once again.
Wow tht is a definite IF ONLY.
We should slip that into Gropers repertoire.
He loves to plagiarize and claim fame.
HP Boston 02.25.09 at 7:55 am
clintondemocrat seems like the worst has happened, it has not.
Don’t give up, take one step at a time and tell everyone you are fabulous couldn’t be better and fuck off!
Life sucks sometimes but not all the time.
Sending Puma love to you and know that you are not alone.
Student loans are the worst rip off as is most everything in our corrupt government. My daughter will have to pay for the rest of her life, interest and collection fees so high she will have been better off NOT going to college TWICE!
sue66 02.25.09 at 7:59 am
Woman Lynching
CALGARY — Mounties say a central Alberta man accused of murdering his estranged wife this week was out on bail after allegedly assaulting her at gunpoint last month.
Delburne resident Brian Clarence Volker, 48, was charged yesterday with first-degree murder in the death of his estranged spouse, Deborah Volker, 44, of Delburne.
Just last month, the accused was charged with sexual assault with a firearm, forcible confinement and pointing a firearm in connection with a Jan. 6 incident involving the victim, said Sgt. Patrick Webb.
The woman obtained an emergency protection order against her estranged husband after he was released on conditions on Jan. 16, he said.
http://www.edmontonsun.com/News/Alberta/2009/02/25/8521006-sun.html
scarlet 02.25.09 at 8:07 am
1999 New York Times Story Predicted the Fannie Mae Mortgage Meltdown
Fannie Mae was pressured to ease loan restrictions for those who couldn’t afford houses.
In a move that could help increase home ownership rates among minorities and low-income consumers, the Fannie Mae Corporation is easing the credit requirements on loans that it will purchase from banks and other lenders.
”Fannie Mae has expanded home ownership for millions of families in the 1990′s by reducing down payment requirements,” said Franklin D. Raines, Fannie Mae’s chairman and chief executive officer. ”Yet there remain too many borrowers whose credit is just a notch below what our underwriting has required who have been relegated to paying significantly higher mortgage rates in the so-called subprime market.”
In moving, even tentatively, into this new area of lending, Fannie Mae is taking on significantly more risk, which may not pose any difficulties during flush economic times. But the government-subsidized corporation may run into trouble in an economic downturn, prompting a government rescue similar to that of the savings and loan industry in the 1980′s.
Fannie Mae, the nation’s biggest underwriter of home mortgages, does not lend money directly to consumers. Instead, it purchases loans that banks make on what is called the secondary market. By expanding the type of loans that it will buy, Fannie Mae is hoping to spur banks to make more loans to people with less-than-stellar credit ratings.
”From the perspective of many people, including me, this is another thrift industry growing up around us,” said Peter Wallison a resident fellow at the American Enterprise Institute. ”If they fail, the government will have to step up and bail them out the way it stepped up and bailed out the thrift industry.”
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9c0DE7DB153EF933A0575AC0A96F958260&sec=&spon=&pagewanted=1
Murphy – Banks do have scrupulous lending standards for loans they are going to keep. They didn’t care about checking incomes or sending appraisers to the homes of the loans that they were going to sell to Fannie Mae. The banks got their fees, then sold these bad loans to someone else.
theamericanway 02.25.09 at 8:08 am
You all are on a roll. Snail mail Winter Fundraiser donation on the way to help keep that roll going.
scarlet 02.25.09 at 8:09 am
PUBLIC FUNDS TO PAY FOR PRIVATE DEBT
Houston aims to clear balances so some can buy homes
By CAROLYN FEIBEL Copyright 2009 Houston Chronicle
Feb. 23, 2009, 10:19PM
Houston taxpayers could start footing the bill to help first-time homebuyers pay off debts and improve their credit scores, under a proposal before City Council this week.
The “Credit Score Enhancement Program” will give up to $3,000 in grants to individuals who are trying to qualify for mortgages through the city’s homebuyers assistance program. City officials say some applicants fall short of eligibility by only 10 or 20 points on their credit scores, and paying off some debt balances can quickly improve their numbers.
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/front/6277344.html
scarlet 02.25.09 at 8:13 am
AMERICAN EXPRESS PAYING CARD HOLDERS TO CLOSE THEIR ACCOUNTS
Monday February 23, 3:03 pm ET
NEW YORK (Reuters) – American Express Co (NYSE:AXP – News), battered by mounting credit card losses, is offering $300 to a limited number of U.S. card holders who pay off their balances and close their accounts, the company said on Monday.
http://biz.yahoo.com/rb/090223/business_us_americanexpress.html?.v=3
taggles1 02.25.09 at 8:18 am
REMIND ME!!!!!
taggles1 02.25.09 at 8:19 am
TO NEVER EVER TRUST THIS FUCKER AND ANYTHING HE EVER SAYS ABOUT SARAH PALIN.
JOHN ZIEGLER PRODUCER OF MEDIA MALPRACTICE IS A SEXIST PIG!
Watch the whole thing!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RQqLPJvk3gM&
theamericanway 02.25.09 at 8:37 am
Obama calls for sacrifice — and more spending
By Julie Mason
Examiner White House Correspondent 2/24/09
Caption under picture of Hillary with BO’s hand on her shoulder. (Poor Hillary.):
President Barack Obama gestures after his address to a joint session of Congress in the House Chamber of the Capitol in Washington, Tuesday, Feb. 24, 2009. Treasury Secretary Tim Geithner is at left, Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton is at right. (AP Photo/Charles Dharapak)
http://www.dcexaminer.com/politics/Obama-calls-for-sacrifice–and-more-spending-40262492.html
scarlet 02.25.09 at 8:41 am
Taggles:
Yesterday, you wanted to know about Republican plans to stimulate the economy. There was one Republican who came up with a bill that never went anywhere nor did it get much support from other legislators. I have no idea if this would have worked.
TAX HOLIDAY BILL
http://pumapac.org/forums/411-on-the-111/ post 11
sistermoon3 02.25.09 at 8:50 am
No matter how much applause Obama got, let’s just remember a few basics here….when Bobby Jindal say instead of funding a “Volcano Watch Program” which is another pork thrown in there
along with such things as Harry Reid’s now toy train, we need to be watching the ERUPTION of washington spending.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
For those of us planning on keeping track of the big government, big spending proposals in President Obama’s first address to Congress tonight, here’s the key: Start with $3.6 trillion. Add from there.
$3.6 trillion is the total amount of new debt that Washington politicians have made taxpayers responsible for thanks to the Bush-Obama big spending, big government, big politician approach to fixing the economy.
Add up all the Bush and Obama spending and stimulus bills of the last year, plus the interest on the debt that they create and that’s (conservatively) what you come up with.
$3.6 trillion. That’s real money, even in Washington
sistermoon3 02.25.09 at 8:55 am
Make it illegal for foreclosures to be recorded on consumer credit reports after five years
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Murphy, I really feel like something not one politician has discussed this the credit bureaus, knowing full well, this is a perfect time to change some rules there in order to help all americans, not just those who are in the foreclosure process, it’s ridiculous.
sistermoon3 02.25.09 at 9:00 am
By the way, they need to add this clip to the documentary on How Obama won the Election” thanks to the media, msnbc once again, showing their prejudice beyond belief, the Oh God and laughter clearly shows you their extreme hate for any republican, it’s out of control over there!!!!!!!!!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W7K8HM0sKxI&fmt=18
sistermoon3 02.25.09 at 9:00 am
By the way, they need to add this clip to the documentary on How Obama won the Election” thanks to the media, msnbc once again, showing their prejudice beyond belief, the Oh God and laughter clearly shows you their extreme hate for any republican, it’s out of control over there!!!!!!!!!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W7K8HM0sKxI&fmt=18
taggles1 02.25.09 at 9:29 am
Scarlet, I wasn’t able to read which tax holiday you are referring. But, if it has anything to do with getting a tax break on buying something it won’t work.
No one has any money to buy anything. How could that be stimulative in any way. It would be a waste in my opinion. Plus it just more of the same. Taxes, taxes taxes.
scarlet 02.25.09 at 9:38 am
OMNIBUS APPROPRIATIONS ACT OF 2009 (HR 1105)
House plans to begin debate today.
This bill does not fund the government for a full year – only from March 2009 through Sept. 2009.
It contains many wasteful spending provisions and earmarks and certain government agencies and programs will be funded twice (under Stimulus bill and this one).
Omnibus Earmarks, Part 1
By
Jamie Dupree
@ February 24, 2009 12:00 AM
Here is just the first portion of the earmarks listed in the $410 billion Omnibus spending bill introduced by Democrats that I have been able to finally format for the internet.
These are a series of road and bridge projects. And let’s remember one thing – these aren’t just home state items for Democrats. There’s a lot of GOP turf in here as well.
That’s the dirty little secret about Washington, D.C. that both parties don’t really want you to know is that when you are in the minority, you still get some pork.
http://wsbradio.com/blogs/jamie_dupree/2009/02/omnibus-earmarks-part-1.html
scarlet 02.25.09 at 9:40 am
taggles1 02.25.09 at 9:29 am
Scarlet, I wasn’t able to read which tax holiday you are referring. But, if it has anything to do with getting a tax break on buying something it won’t work.
————–
It has nothing to do with getting a tax break on a purchase.
taggles1 02.25.09 at 9:43 am
scarlet, could you provide me with the correct link? The one provided was broken. TIA.
bmw60 02.25.09 at 9:44 am
*********** INTERESTING INFORMATION TO MAKE HEAD SPIN *********
http://cantotalk.blogspot.com/2009/02/presidents-speech-will-be-expensive.html
scarlet 02.25.09 at 9:48 am
Taggles – It worked for me. If you are having trouble, try 411 on the 111 pumapac Forum. Link on left.
TAX HOLIDAY BILL
http://pumapac.org/forums/411-on-the-111/ post 11
bmw60 02.25.09 at 9:51 am
*******HOW WILL OUR COUNTRY BE DEFINED? *********
http://atlasshrugs2000.typepad.com/atlas_shrugs/2009/02/murdoch-warns-nations-will-be-redefined-futures-altered.html
bmw60 02.25.09 at 9:57 am
******** AH, ANOTHER SOCIALISTIC LOOK AT THE WELFARE SYSTEM ****
http://americac2c.ning.com/profiles/blog/list?user=2vjzctd278vzz
sistermoon3 02.25.09 at 9:57 am
Markets »
Updated: 9:49 am ET, February 25
-81.40(-1.11%)Dow 7,269.54-15.59(-1.08%)Nasdaq 1,426.24-9.19(-1.19%)S&P 763.95
Oops, it seems everytime he opens his mouth well, ummm the facts are the facts
taggles1 02.25.09 at 10:09 am
It includes social security payroll taxes??? Why would anyone want to mess with social security. I am pretty angry that barack obama thinks SS is an entitlement program, when I have been paying into it and they keep taking money out of it.
And last night he is talking about reforming it and mentioning tax free accounts.
I am sorry, but my 401K is tax free until I go to touch the money and the stock market has eaten away all the gains.
Keep Social Security healthy and politicians mitts off of it.
bmw60 02.25.09 at 10:09 am
********* REBUT TO ERIC HOLDERS SPEECH ******
COULDN’T HAVE SAID IT BETTER MYSELF!!
http://blog.unheardamericanvoices.com/2009/02/21/eric-holder-eric-holder-wants-a-discussion-on-raceok-here-it-is.aspx
taggles1 02.25.09 at 10:12 am
Plus I think “socialistic” Barack Obama’s pittance tax cuts that we are getting starting april fools day are coming out of payroll taxes like social security not income tax.
scarlet 02.25.09 at 10:13 am
OMNIBUS APPROPRIATIONS ACT OF 2009 (HR 1105)
This spending is above and beyond those provided in the Stimulus Bill:
“HEALTHCARE RATIONING” – In addition to the $1.1 billion included the Stimulus Bill, HR 1105 provides an additional $50 million to conduct “comparative effectiveness research to evaluate the effectiveness of different preventative health interventions. Some members are concerned that the money for comparative effectiveness research could eventually by used for government rationing of health care goods and services, consistent with draft House Appropriations Committee report on the Stimulus Bill noting that the more expensive treatments will no longer be prescribed as a result of such research. It sounds like the same system England uses which is rationing health care and meds. For more info about National Institute for Health and Clinical Excellence (NICE)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Institute_for_Health_and_Clinical_Excellence
CENSUS – Provides $3.13 billion for the 2010 census, which recently received $1 billion in additional “stimulus” money.
Here are some funds that will be cut back:
DC School Vouchers: Elimates the DC school voucher program. HR 1105 prohibits any new students from receiving vouchers and sunsets the program after the 2009-2010 school year. The bill will eliminate $1.8 million for a program that I heard was successful.
Notyoursweetie 02.25.09 at 10:16 am
And this is how dropping in approval IS A GOOD THING FOR OBAMA
http://edgeoforever.wordpress.com/2009/02/25/spinning-the-polls/
scarlet 02.25.09 at 10:18 am
taggles1 02.25.09 at 10:09 am
It includes social security payroll taxes??? Why would anyone want to mess with social security.
—————————
The bill called for 5 months, not messing with social security.
The bill isn’t going anywhere anyhow.
DancesWithPumas 02.25.09 at 10:21 am
Notyoursweetie 02.25.09 at 10:16 am
And this is how dropping in approval IS A GOOD THING FOR OBAMA
http://edgeoforever.wordpress.com/2009/02/25/spinning-the-polls/
—————-
Interesting… love the “pre-determined” dig at Gallup.
Illinois Indy Woman 02.25.09 at 10:27 am
One very important point was missing from “the speech from the one” last night. That is after all this unlimited bailout, stimulus, recovery (or whatever they call it) the USA will be owned by the Chinese. Obama’s speech made it sound like it’s just a matter of keeping the presses running printing enough money. Hillary better set up a permanent office in China cause that’s where our other Capitol is going to be.
scarlet 02.25.09 at 10:31 am
Satellite to Study Global-Warming Gases Lost in Space (Update4)
By Alex Morales
Feb. 24 (Bloomberg) — A satellite launched from California failed to reach orbit today, crashing into the sea near Antarctica and dooming a $273 million mission to study global- warming gases.
“The mission is lost,” National Aeronautics and Space Administration spokesman Steve Cole said in a telephone interview from the launch site at Vandenberg Air Force Base in California.
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601103&sid=av6QSiI5BuOI&refer=us
clintondemocrat 02.25.09 at 10:34 am
scarlet 02.25.09 at 9:40 am
taggles1 02.25.09 at 9:29 am
Scarlet, I wasn’t able to read which tax holiday you are referring. But, if it has anything to do with getting a tax break on buying something it won’t work.
Oh my god, sales tax holidays piss me off. We do that in tennessee and it is on the most mundane items: notebook paper, pencils, crayons, etc. The thing about it is, they do it during back to school when all that crap is literally so damn cheap anyway. But the stores are crowded with thousands of people getting their stuff “tax free” and I look at those parking lots and think about how it doesn’t really impact the economic status of a single individual but it sure as hell pisses me off when we get to 8 or 9 or 10 months later and our state is short in the budget and then I think, i wonder how much tax revenue for state operatiosn was lost because somebody got say 200 dollars worth of crap tax free times 100,000 people.
DancesWithPumas 02.25.09 at 10:34 am
$273 million mission to study global- warming gases.
—————
They should have spent the $4000 cross-country one way and trucked the satellite to DC if they wanted to study long winded hot air gasbags.
jenniforhillary 02.25.09 at 10:37 am
FYI….Fucking Bill White, Smuck Mayor of Houston Texas will NOT be giving away $3,000 to each deadbeat alleged soon to be defaulting wanna be home buyer…
seems a couple FUCKING THOUSAND phone calls to his office yesterday convinced him he is not the fucking messiah….yet
GOD DAMN IT these politicians are outa fucking control…
scarlet 02.25.09 at 10:38 am
Obama’s trillions dwarf Bush’s ‘dangerous’ spending
By Byron York
Chief political correspondent 2/24/09
Pelosi and Reid called Bush’s budgets “dangerous” and “unpatriotic,” but with Obama, they’ve changed their tune
Back in 2006, when Democrats were hoping to win control of the House and Senate, party leaders worked themselves into a righteous outrage over the issue of out-of-control federal spending. Rep. Nancy Pelosi, D-Calif., called the Republican budget “irresponsible” and “unpatriotic” because it increased the amount of U.S. debt held by foreign countries. Sen. Harry Reid, D-Nev., accused Republicans of going on “an unprecedented and dangerous borrowing spree” and declared GOP leadership “the most fiscally irresponsible in the history of our country … no other president or Congress even comes close.”
You won’t find too many defenders of George W. Bush’s record on spending these days, even among Republicans. But a check of historical tables compiled by the Office of Management and Budget shows that the spending that so distressed Pelosi and Reid seems downright modest today. After beginning with a Clinton-era surplus of $128 billion in fiscal year 2001, the Bush administration racked up deficits of $158 billion in 2002, $378 billion in 2003, $413 billion in 2004, $318 billion in 2005, $248 billion in 2006, $162 billion in 2007, and $410 billion in 2008.
The current administration would kill to have such small numbers.
http://www.dcexaminer.com/politics/Obamas-trillions-dwarf-Bushs-dangerous-spending.html
scarlet 02.25.09 at 10:42 am
clintondemocrat 02.25.09 at 10:34 am
Oh my god, sales tax holidays piss me off.
——————
The Tax Holiday Bill had nothing to do with sales tax. I don’t remember ever having a sales tax holiday in IL. They just keeping raising sale taxes here.
Headclunker 02.25.09 at 10:43 am
Hey! Somebody send Murphy’s post to the Whitehouse, quick!
BO tanked the market again and the Dow just dropped below 7200 (again).
FLBarbara 02.25.09 at 10:52 am
Murphy,
I am standing up and applauding you.
Clap clap clap
bmw60 02.25.09 at 10:59 am
******** INTERESTED IN A TEA PARTY? HERE ARE THE LOCATIONS *****
HERE IS A COMPLETE LIST OF THE TEA PARTIES ACROSS THE COUNTRY
Tea Party Protests Being PlannedWashington, DC
Friday, Feb. 27th
12:00pm
Washington Monument
Chicago, IL
Friday, Feb. 27th
11:00am central
Daley PlazaSaint Louis, MO
Friday, February 27th
11:00am – 12:00pm
The Steps of the Arch on Wharf Street
Atlanta, GA
Friday, Feb. 27th
State Capitol (Washington Street exit)
12:00pmHouston, TX
Feb. 27th
11:00am
Fondren Green at Discovery Green Park
(in front of the amphitheater)Fort Worth, TX
Feb. 27th
The outside stage at The Cowtown Bar & Grill
7108 Camp Bowie Blvd
3:00pm – 7:00pm
Pittsburgh, PA
Feb. 27th, 2009
12pm – 1pm
Market Square
Fort Myers, FL
Feb. 27th from 11:00am – 1:30pm
Bowditch Point Park
San Diego, CA
Feb. 27th
The harbor, just north of the Star of India
9:00am
Greenville, SC
Feb. 27th
Main Street
6:00pm
Tulsa, OK
Feb. 27, 2009
12:00pm – 1:00pm
Veterans Park
21st and BoulderCleveland, OH
February 27, 2009
12:00pm – 1:00pm
Public Square in Downtown Cleveland
Orlando, FL
Feb. 27th
12:00pm-2:00pm
Lake Eola
Fayetteville, NC
Feb. 27th
Liberty Point Resolves Marker on Hay Street
12:00pm
Lansing, MI
Friday, February, 27, 2009
12:00pm – 1:00pm at
State Capitol in Lansing
Sacramento, CA – MARA SACRAMENTO, CA.
Feb. 27th
12:00pm
State Capitol steps
Sarasota, FL
Friday, February 27, 2009
12:00pm – 1:00pm
Island Park and Marina Jacks
Bayfront Drive (41) and Ringling Blvd
Denver, CO
Friday, February 27, 2009
10:00am – 11:00pm
Colorado State Capitol Building – EAST side steps
200 E. Colfax Ave
Philadelphia, PA
Saturday, Feb. 28th
12:00pm
Independence Hall
Kansas City, MO
Saturday, Feb. 28th
10:00am – 2:00pm
J.C. Nichols Foundation
47th and J.C. Nichols Parkway
New York City
Saturday, Feb. 28th
City Hall Park
2:00pm
Lafayette, LA
March 7th, 2009
1:00pm in Veterans Park
200 Feu Follett Road
Orlando, FL
March 21, 2009
12:00pm
101 N Rosalind AveRancho
Cucamonga, CA
April 11, 2009
4:11pm
Foothill Blvd/Haven Ave
Vancouver, WA
April 18th
Lawn of Clark County Courthouse
11am to 1pm
Chicago, IL
July 4th
7:00pm
Belmont Harbor
Lakeshore Drive
Boston, MA
Saturday, July 4th
12:00pm
Griffin Harbor
Los Angeles, CA
Saturday, July 4th
Santa Monica Pier
7:00am-12:00pm
scarlet 02.25.09 at 11:11 am
Obama Expected to Make Announcement Later This Week
Posted February 24, 2009
Officials say that the Obama Administration intends to have most troops out of Iraq by August 2010, replacing the president’s 16 month timetable from the campaign with a 19 month one that would end with a considerable “residual force” beyond that date.
President Obama will reportedly make an announcement sometime this week with regards to the plan, which could see as many as 100,000 troops pulled from the nation after nearly six years of war. It is at this point unclear how many of those troops will be returning home and how many will be shifting to Afghanistan.
There are currently 142,000 US troops in Iraq, and the officials say between 30,000 and 50,000 troops will remain after August 2010, in addition to an undefined number of surveillance specialists and equipment
http://news.antiwar.com/2009/02/24/officials-most-us-troops-to-leave-iraq-by-august-2010/
IMO, until we get every American troop off of Islamic soil, we will never be safe from terrorists.
girlsrule 02.25.09 at 11:13 am
I am going to the Washington Tea Party on Friday, I will be representing “Mom’s against generational theft”. I could use some ideas for signs!!!!!
scarlet 02.25.09 at 11:18 am
Statement Concerning Unprecedented Release Of GITMO Terrorist
Mon, 02/23/2009 – 13:06
Washington, DC – February 23, 2008 – This morning, Military Families United learned that Guantanamo Bay detainee Binyam Mohamed landed in England at 8:30 EST as a free man. This marks the first time an ‘unlawful enemy combatant’ has been released from Gitmo back into society.
Former USS Commander Cole Commander Kirk S. Lippold and Senior Military Fellow for Military Families United released the following statement:
“Actions speak stronger than words in the war on terror. In the Executive Order, signed by the President on January 22, the Attorney General was directed to conduct a 180 day review of Guantanamo Detentions. The Attorney General had not even arrived in Guantanamo Bay to start the review before the Administration released a terrorist designated an unlawful enemy combatant.
Note – This is an unprecedented release because it is the first time that a GITMO detainee, who is classified as an “Unlawful Enemy Combatant” has been released – meaning that he still poses a threat to our national security and the security of our allies. All of the previous released GITMO detainees were declassified and determined to no longer be of intelligence value or pose a threat to our country.
More at:
http://www.militaryfamiliesunited.org/?q=media/statement-concerning-unprecedented-release-gitmo-terrorist-0
Amnesty International is pleased with the “terrorist’s” release.
Binyam Mohamed: Release ‘not a moment too soon’-others must not languish at Guantanamo
http://amnesty.org.uk/news_details.asp?NewsID=18083
FLBarbara 02.25.09 at 11:18 am
Even though Obama replaced the word crisis with the word confidence in last nights speech. A hundred times.
It obvious wall street is still not confident in his ability to “rebuild this nation”
They have obviously recognised replacing one word for another without actually offering a constructive plan on how to get from crisis to confidence is more reason to panic and sell..
Wall street is looking for a reason to be confident and Obamas 1 hour of repeating the word confident obviously has left wall street feeling crisis.
theamericanway 02.25.09 at 11:37 am
And over at Politico there’s Senator Byrd saying Obama is in a power grab:
Sen. Robert Byrd (D-W.Va.), the longest serving Democratic senator, is criticizing President Obama’s appointment of White House “czars” to oversee federal policy, saying these executive positions amount to a power grab by the executive branch….
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0209/19303.html
FLBarbara 02.25.09 at 11:44 am
Scarlets post on the release of a terrorist who is now free in England is a perfect example of
Why Wall street is not feeling confident in the Obama administration.
Terrorist free to plot and plan another 911.
How confident are you feeling knowing Gitmo will soon be empty?
mountainsong 02.25.09 at 11:48 am
Obama sure is full of himself and loves to talk. But it’s not only “just talk”, he outlined a blueprint for the total obliteration of this country. A 90 year old man, on the verge of tears, asks me to explain how we can get out of debt by borrowing more money. He is sad for his children and grandchildren and greatgrandchildren because they have only slavery and poverty in their futures.
And I still haven’t seen anything “first” or “lady” about his First Lady”. Why hasn’t she stepped up for Equal Rights? Children’s Rights? Instead of making a show on the back of some teenager. I had to turn away last night at the sight of all those in that room who make a mockery of everything I’ve ever been taught to believe about this country. I’ve seen rocks with more reverence.
mountainsong 02.25.09 at 11:51 am
Every time he moves his lips, which is every day, the DJIA goes down.
henry 02.25.09 at 11:52 am
MURPHY
I apologize for not asking your permission first but I used your early posts and some video that you have posted with a bunch of my 9 year old niece and her friends and had theN created books of their own about finding a voice–Their own voice.
After spending several hours with them I came here and perhaps was less than savory. I care about human rights not just women’s and I believe you have created something profound but please do not make it a site that proceeds to bash men.
Also as I posted a few nights ago several companies offer the oppurtunity to arrange a benefit carnival. To all of those who have learned how to play the game or work a system why not engage a young girl with a Muscular Dystophy carnival. At an early age she can learn how to run a busness. I have already taken my niece to the zoo, the museum and several restaurants asking with a proposal for a donation and rec’d gift cerificates for the carnival. I might offend but I think its a very easy way to teach all kids their own power. Big sisters?
bmw60 02.25.09 at 11:53 am
They’re doing it one piece at a time and people don’t even see it mountainsong… one piece at a time… but this 90 year old man can see the future because he has wisdom.
POWER CORRUPTS AND WE HAVE NO CHECKS AND BALANCES ANYMORE!!!
PUMAbear 02.25.09 at 11:54 am
I think the Bush regime acknowledged that many Gitmo detainees were completely innocent, turned in by tribal rivals for large cash rewards. Some were German or Briti h citizens whose govts campaigned for their return.
Good piece in Cannonfire.
Great job Murph. U can be VP on Hill’s
Ubelievable-Daily Kos is carrying a screed about *awful* Roland Burris, another on Bristol Palin and great praise for 85 per cent confidence rating for Oblahblah.
admin 02.25.09 at 11:55 am
worker strikes in Greece:
http://www.reuters.com/article/marketsNews/idUSLP45582720090225
bmw60 02.25.09 at 11:58 am
STOCK MARKET DOWN 125 PTS AT THIS TIME…
You are right.. every time he opens his mouth, because they know, they know that this country is going socialist one piece at a time and they want out…
Stock market in a free country? They are smart and know where this country is going!
FLBarbara 02.25.09 at 12:01 pm
Mountainsong,
Re Michele she was asked by Vital Voices to continue the work of former First Ladies Hillary Clinton and Laura Bush. They were told she has not decided on a platform and then she was taking up the cause of military families which is admirable BUT our First Ladies have all been a voice for Womens Equality even when involved in other platforms.
She is just not that into us.
sistermoon3 02.25.09 at 12:05 pm
Source: Obama to give speech about Iraq on Friday
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Yippeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee another speech, wow, we just cant get enough
BillieJo 02.25.09 at 12:06 pm
Yup, stocks tank as a response to the Kool-aid speech.
Inspired yet obots?
How ’bout all that money you donated to him because you had Hope and Change………….missing those big bucks yet?
Don’t worry, there will be enough money in your paycheck for a cheap lunch once a week for this year, and a cut back to just a salad and cracks each week next year.
If you loose your job, no free meal from BO and MO nor Joe.
Keep the change and pass the Kool-aid.
BillieJo 02.25.09 at 12:07 pm
oooooooops……..hehe not ‘crack’ nor ‘cracks’………crackers.
FLBarbara 02.25.09 at 12:08 pm
BillieJo
What’s a paycheck?
LOL
henry 02.25.09 at 12:09 pm
BillieJo
Markets don’t close for hours. Me thinks that it can be manipulated much later in the day when the uberrich can buy up more and give the chosen one his desired outcome. Gotta wait til 4 to see.
BillieJo 02.25.09 at 12:09 pm
sistermoon3 02.25.09 at 12:05 pm
Source: Obama to give speech about Iraq on Friday
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Yippeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee another speech, wow, we just cant get enough
=======
That’s all the puppet emptysuit knows how to do besides pose and sign autographs. Without his teleprompter speeches what would he do, play basket ball, pester Nancy and the congress???
BillieJo 02.25.09 at 12:13 pm
FLBarbara
BillieJo
What’s a paycheck?
LOL
—–
Jeepers, I better not say anything to that, or off with my head.
I was talkin’ to obots and hope you are okay flBarb
Deb55 02.25.09 at 12:16 pm
Good Morning All
Have been lurking to stay caught up over the last 2 weeks, working a lot…some great reads…Thanks..
Just had this emailed over to me wanted to share…
I guess O’s plan isn’t working with Iran,..he was going to play nice, the real world doesn’t work that way, not when they have other plans for us..the Great Infidals..
http://www.reuters.com/article/topNews/idUSLP58564820090225?feedType=RSS&feedName=topNews&rpc=22&sp=true
FLBarbara 02.25.09 at 12:19 pm
BillieJo,
No not off with your head your too valuable.
Obots on the other hand we can line them up give them their last glass of Kool-aide whatever flavor and start them on their way to the YES we can song.
I am fine I collect a check from the state on NY!! Thanks to Obama being selected.
taggles1 02.25.09 at 12:23 pm
when the US gov’t participates in torture where ones penis is sliced over 30 times and one is hung by their hands and feet for two days, don’t look for much sympathy for the gov’t who set him free.
That is why torture is bad! It does not help and it makes the world hate us when we break our own laws, and what is to stop other countries from doing it to our soldiers.
Also, he was released because the US did not want to provide the documents and evidence of the mans torture at the hands of the US and Great Brittain.
I don’t know if he was a terrorist or not, and neither does the US States Gov’t.
I don’t care whether or not he is a detainee or is or is not a prisoner of war or any other reason people make to ok the use of torture.
It is wrong. This case should prove it.
henry 02.25.09 at 12:28 pm
taggles
we are not dealing with a legitimate government.
Chop off the heads of individuals and then hide behind the ruse that no gov’t supported them. I guess you beleve that we should permit such abuses to continue?
henry 02.25.09 at 12:31 pm
taggles
PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE
post validation for your thirty times a penis has been cut. I googled, yahoohed and msn search anf found nothing
taggles1 02.25.09 at 12:32 pm
Henry, the law of the United States is that we do not torture.
The ruse is using excuses like “no gov’t supports them” to torture people.
BillieJo 02.25.09 at 12:33 pm
So taggles1,
what did you think of O’jackass plan for the foreclosures…in his speech last night?
Max of $2000/year savings on mortage bill that is refinanced.
That’s a savings of a max of $167/month reduction in each mortgage payment but just makes the time to pay off the house longer. How many people can prevent foreclosure with $167 reduction?
Wonder where the thought of $20k per foreclosure went…to the bank for the refinance???????
henry 02.25.09 at 12:35 pm
Taggles
I asked for proof of what you said where can I find any info about what you said transpired?
taggles1 02.25.09 at 12:36 pm
The court papers describe horrific treatment in secret prisons. Mr. Mohamed claimed that during his detention in Morocco, “he was routinely beaten, suffering broken bones and, on occasion, loss of consciousness. His clothes were cut off with a scalpel and the same scalpel was then used to make incisions on his body, including his penis. A hot stinging liquid was then poured into open wounds on his penis where he had been cut. He was frequently threatened with rape, electrocution and death.”
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/02/10/us/10torture.html
He wrote: “One of them took my penis in his hand and began to make cuts. He did it once, and they stood still for maybe a minute, watching my reaction. I was in agony.
“They must have done this 20 to 30 times, in maybe two hours. There was blood all over. One of them said it would be better just to cut it off, as I would only breed terrorists.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/majornews/4514818/Torture-row-Binyam-Mohamed-on-hunger-strike-and-close-to-death.html
taggles1 02.25.09 at 12:37 pm
for goodness sakes, give me a minute henry. i posted it above.
admin 02.25.09 at 12:37 pm
just read this in a comment on another blog. Careful readers will note that I called this over a week ago. The threat to our national unity that o’logo and the feckless congress are RECKLESSLY playing with is REAL. The tensions between the states will intensify and lines will be drawn:
“uh oh.
the fighting will now commence!!!!
the New Jersey congressman is asking why New Jersey and Vermont need to pay to keep foreclosures in California down.
Yearning To Learn | 02.25.09 – 12:38 pm |”
mountainsong 02.25.09 at 12:43 pm
henry 02.25.09 at 11:52 am Henry, you set an example that is not only admirable, but an inspiration. Thank you.
Now!! If someone would just explain to me what is “Great” and what is “Free” about a country that does NOT accord equal rights to it’s women and children? No more kool aid and no more bullshit!!!!
NONE of those fuckers on the TV last night are worried about foreclosure, going hungry or being reduced to living in poverty.
Every fucking one of them has a job and are overpaid.
Any business that needs to BORROW money to meet it’s payroll is NOT solvent. Any individual that needs to BORROW money to buy a car or house or anything else, does so because they can’t AFFORD it in the first place and the only ones that profit are the lenders. Credit is EVIL!!!
I bet everyone there last night has a house that is PAID FOR. And car. They only use credit cards for their excesses.
I really believe it’s to the point now where a revolution would be a God damned waste of time!!!!!!!
BillieJo 02.25.09 at 12:44 pm
the fighting will now commence!!!!
the New Jersey congressman is asking why New Jersey and Vermont need to pay to keep foreclosures in California down.
———-
Does it really matter who is holding the roll of toilet paper when we are all standing in a shit-hole?
henry 02.25.09 at 12:46 pm
taggles1
i believe there is no validity to those claims as if I follow your train of thoght the guy would have been killed else the big bad government would have offered him enough money to stay silent.
mountainsong 02.25.09 at 12:47 pm
Every Senior Citizen I talk to, who has lived through it all, is hopping mad that people who knew better than to go in debt are being asked to pay to help lower the payments for those who didn’t. Today, someone said a MBA means Master Bullshit Artist.
PUMAbear 02.25.09 at 12:48 pm
Henery,
Bush gov’t admitted it used waterboarding, a torture used by the inquisition. Pictures at. Abu Graib were also evidence.
Not every person is a terrorist. Enemy combatants are just that. When you overthrow a nation and take over its army and people continue to resist are they terrorists or guerillas?
The US backed some of the militias in Iraq, mostly Sunni, didn’t they. Was every side terrorist?
taggles1 02.25.09 at 12:49 pm
your conjecture is pure speculation and opinion, in the face of presented facts in a court of law.
Did you actually read the articles how the US Gov’t under Bush and then Obama used the “state secrets” argument to not implicate the US in torture it damn well knew took place.
BillieJo 02.25.09 at 12:52 pm
So taggles1,
what did you think of O’jackass plan for the foreclosures…in his speech last night?
Max of $2000/year savings on mortage bill that is refinanced.
That’s a savings of a max of $167/month reduction in each mortgage payment but just makes the time to pay off the house longer. How many people can prevent foreclosure with $167 reduction?
Wonder where the thought of $20k per foreclosure went…to the bank for the refinance???????
—–
(I wanted to re-post this for taggles, how she will see it…)
BillieJo 02.25.09 at 12:53 pm
Yipes, my keyboard keeps making typos
henry 02.25.09 at 12:53 pm
mountainsong
An80 year old woman said to me yesterday give me my social security money that I have paid into for as long as she can remember and let me handle my own future rather than be scared half to dearh by politcans?????????
taggles1 02.25.09 at 12:57 pm
Billi Jo, I never thought his plan was sufficient. My objection was calling hard working people who had fallen on hard times LOSERS and DEAD BEATS. Therefore my FUCK SANTELLI mantra.
I believe the majority of blame belongs to Wall Street and the Banks for the lending of that money and their own fraudulent financial instruments which caused this economy to collapse and cause people who were not even involved in sub prime mortgages to be put at risk.
Yes, I do think mortgage foreclosure need to be stemmed. If not more people are at risk of losing their homes, for a multitude of reasons I have explained on blogs throughout the week.
Obama is not really providing real solutions for working people and there are things we can call him on to make him help people, not corrupt wall street fuckers and bankers.
henry 02.25.09 at 1:06 pm
taggles1
sorry gotta say I think the majority of the blame should fall upon the American electorate as they responded to the election of a president like it was American Idol. One has to wonder who pulled the plug on the tv show already to go pre-election called the American President?
PUMAbear 02.25.09 at 1:10 pm
What caused house values to triple in 7 years? Too much investor money parked there because US interest rates have been near zero for years. Holding the weak dollar and watching the debts you hold inflate away costs our lenders big time.
Inflated values and relatively high interest rates drove excess building and real estate investment. The big stocholders wanted it that way. Consmer and credit card debt was also included in the bundling. America makes its money servicing debt with the ultimate rescue plan an infusion of federal cash.
BillieJo 02.25.09 at 1:15 pm
taggles, I have nothing against helping homeowners that have paid their mortgages for years on time and are now unemployed…helping them over the short term.
I would like to see all the loans that were interest only, no down…default without help. These homes were not ‘bought’ and tax money should not go to keep the scam going nor beef up the fraud banks for fraud loans. The congress passed laws that made this possible, and Wall Street and the banks played with our economy and now we are all paying for it it around the flippin’ world.
Hugs.
girlsrule 02.25.09 at 1:16 pm
I am not sure if this has been posted, sorry if it is redundant:
Two soldiers challenge their new commander-in-chief’s eligibility:
http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=89837
http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=89941
taggles1 02.25.09 at 1:17 pm
People can be so blind sometimes.
Let us call eachother names, fight with one another on how you don’t want your tax dollars to go to your neighbor, and all the while the gov’t and wall street sits back and laughs their asses off, cause what is one gonna say when they are told we need to help the banks, when in reality that is what has been happening all along.
Frig that psychological BS.
As long as it isn’t helping your frigging neighbor, when it isn’t even doing that in the first place.
Give em more excuses to crook us out of more money. Bend over and get fucked the good ole american way and piss away your own interests because people fall for this ridiculous bologne.
You watch no republicans will be upset when the banks need a trillion or two.
But many are happy have given them excuses to never help the lowly peon.
FUCK SANTELLI
jenniforhillary 02.25.09 at 1:18 pm
I’m with Henry. WE, the PEOPLE, elected these smucks…and WE, the PEOPLE, need to WAKE UP!!
We need to demand MORE responsiblity on the part of EVERY SINGLE FUCKING HUMAN BEING starting with me. or you.
NOW. Right Fucking NOW.
scarlet 02.25.09 at 1:19 pm
“It is universally recognized that when you invest in stocks, you are taking a risk–and just as you deserve the profits if the investment goes well, so you must accept the losses if it doesn’t.
“The same holds true for real estate. Whether you are an investment bank holding mortgage-backed securities, a borrower with an adjustable-rate mortgage facing foreclosure, or an ‘underwater homeowner’ who owes more than your home is worth, the essence of your situation is the same: you chose to enter into a real estate transaction that has gone bad. And just as you had every right to any gains that might have ensued–so you must bear full responsibility for your losses.
http://www.aynrand.org/site/News2?page=NewsArticle&id=18729&news_iv_ctrl=2702
taggles1 02.25.09 at 1:19 pm
Billi jo, that above rant was not for you. It was just a rant in general.
hugs!
taggles1 02.25.09 at 1:21 pm
Does FRAUD fit in there anywhere Scarlet?
Also, how about complete economic collapse?
henry 02.25.09 at 1:22 pm
TAGGLES1
OR JUST GET PAID TO COME HERE AND BE NICE TO TRY TO DISSUADE ALL FROM THE TRUTH
BillieJo 02.25.09 at 1:24 pm
taggles
I know.
Things were terrible in June when we were screwed and pissed off…….and now things are worse. No happy face here either.
mountainsong 02.25.09 at 1:24 pm
henry 02.25.09 at 12:53 pm
Yes, Henry, it was the elders who came out of the Depression and WW II, who worked their asses off to attain the highest standard of living in the world in the 1950′s. They, we, are heartbroken over what those who came after have done. This is not the vision we had for our children.
We need to BE responsible, not just demand it of others. If the day ever comes that I can’t wipe my own ass, shoot me.
Notyoursweetie 02.25.09 at 1:25 pm
NYC tabloids fall all over themselves
http://edgeoforever.wordpress.com/2009/02/25/tabloids-on-the-best-speech-ever/
jenniforhillary 02.25.09 at 1:26 pm
taggles, now I am going to have to say you are WRONG. ABSOLUTELY WRONG.
First, every one of my republican friends, associates here in Texas voted Hillary and would have voted for her again if she hadn’t been robbed. EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THEM. These same people are as tired of the REPUBLICAN agenda as we are. I have some HARD CORE as in military flew for GW Bush and his pappy ready for NEW, ready for Hillary voters.
Second, they are UNHAPPY with ALL POLITICIANS. JUST LIKE WE ARE!!! And they want something new–a lot of them lurk here so when we say bad things about all republicans it isn’t helping our cause any at all.
Third, I was as blind and dumb as they were because I actually thought Democraps cared about me as a woman, as an American, as a voter. Boy was I dumb. and blind. So who am I to cast aspersions on those who already realized that Democraps are JUST AS BAD as Republicans except they give the money to their friends AND a few poor people, instead of just their friends.
Fourth, BOTH parties fucking SUCK. And no one is perfect. And bottom line responsibility must start with ME and YOU and THEM…and them is every single one of them from the welfare mother with 5 kids and one on the way to Marian Wright Edelman to Hillary Rodham Clinton to John McCain to EVERY SINGLE PERSON. Until the bottom line is we are all going to tow the line we are never going to get this mess figured out.
And I love Santelli. sorry, but he speaks for me when he chastises the giving away of good money after bad. Krugman and every economist that my little brain thinks has it going on thinks it is bad juju and so do I. Yes, we need to spend some money but not what we are doing AND as Mitch McConnel (sp?) said there are 10 GOOD fixes for the economy and NOT ONE involves spending money we don’t have. Google him and read them because they are absolutely fantastic ideas and makes me wonder why he isn’t being interviewed by every single media source….oh wait, could it be because Nobama and the Democraps don’t really want to save the economy and help people they just want to spend money and feather their own nests….
THINK ABOUT IT PEOPLE….TIME TO WAKE UP!!
BillieJo 02.25.09 at 1:28 pm
henry…be nice to taggles even if you disagree.
I don’t care if terrorists get their xxxx’s crunched, I just care that it will open the door for abuse to our military.
mountainsong 02.25.09 at 1:28 pm
I don’t owe anyone a dime~~~but I DO owe it to all brothers and sisters to help them if I can. I struggle with what that means. Does it mean I should help pay down the mortgage of those who have a house already, or those who have no shelter at all?
mountainsong 02.25.09 at 1:31 pm
Dow Jones Industrial Average(DJI: ^DJI)
Index Value: 7,215.30
Trade Time: 1:30pm ET
Change: 135.64 (1.85%)
Prev Close: 7,350.94
Open: 7,349.58
Day’s Range: 7,156.68 – 7,350.30
52wk Range: 7,077.35 – 13,191.50
mountainsong 02.25.09 at 1:32 pm
Politicians graves aren’t even worth pissing on.
sistermoon3 02.25.09 at 1:33 pm
Hey, remember the Much Ado about the RNC paying so much for Gov. Sarah Palin’s wardrobe, well, hey have you seen this about Michelle Obama’s clothes?
http://www.newsmax.com/kessler/michelle_obama_fashion/2009/02/23/184613.html
taggles1 02.25.09 at 1:33 pm
What do people propose, to prevent further economic instability and collapse?
Should we give all our money to banks to keep them afloat. They are the deserving party?
Something has to be done. What is it.
jenniforhillary 02.25.09 at 1:34 pm
oh, and as far as tortue by governments go if you think what happened at gitmo is bad then you don’t understand that that passes for sex in pornography and is done every day to women and people with no choices and America is still the best fucking place to live and die and be in jail. period. end of story.
Letting these people go and chastising USA does not make me happy when, on the continuum of things, we were in a war people…a fucking war….
and don’t forget that there are millions of men with swords who would love to rape, pillage and chop your head off. millions of them. millions and millions.
scarlet 02.25.09 at 1:42 pm
taggles
Fannie Mae was pressured to ease loan restrictions for those who couldn’t afford houses. Banks and lenders made bad loans. It was the government who pushed these bad loans. They should be held accountable. What part is the fraud?
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9c0DE7DB153EF933A0575AC0A96F958260&sec=&spon=&pagewanted=1
Were the buyers buying fraudulently or was it the real estate person who sold the property to them selling it to them fraudulently? I really don’t know where the fraud came in?
PUMAbear 02.25.09 at 1:43 pm
What money does Amrica have to spend except borrowed money?
Reagan said not to worry when Our manufacturing base began to disappear. We were promised “service” jobs would fill the gapn then high tech and brain jobs.Those jobs are disappearing and tech, business and medical staff are imported to replace. The American let that happen spending more time blaming each other.
We thought we were powerful because our military might is unchallenged but we can’t even continue to play pax Americana with an economy built on consumer spending.
America was powerful after WWII because it was an industrial powerhouse after the conversion of military to consumer production. All other industrial countries were just rubble. The great minds, the industrial tycoons no longer innovate, just produce cheap junky products in third world countries.
pigpaws 02.25.09 at 1:43 pm
Scarlet -
Murphy – Banks do have scrupulous lending standards for loans they are going to keep. They didn’t care about checking incomes or sending appraisers to the homes of the loans that they were going to sell to Fannie Mae. The banks got their fees, then sold these bad loans to someone else.
The government forced them to make loans to people that were high risk. That NYTimes story says so and warns what would happen during a downturn.
Look up the Community Reinvestment Act of 1977, which also hilights the Clinton administration, under Reno, who put the turbo-boosters on it, under penalty of law.
The government caused it and I’m seeing people here saying the same government should totally take the banks over?
mountainsong 02.25.09 at 1:45 pm
Don’t give money to banks at all. My parents generation had their money in banks for safekeeping. Obviously, that system was totally abused.
The only way people have ever gotten out of messes before was by livng within their means, no matter what that meant. Saving money until they had enough to buy what they needed and going without if they didn’t have the money.
Allowing others to manage our money has got us where we are.
Like the 80 year old woman Henry refered to~~” Let me have my money and I will manage it myself.”
Those CEO’s and managers, who held our money in “trust” received exorbitant, undeserved bonuses as they bilked us into poverty.
girlsrule 02.25.09 at 1:45 pm
Has it only been a month, UGH, seems like an eternity. Our rights are being stripped fast and furious and now this. If you have children be aware of this:
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/02/25/boxer-seeks-ratify-treaty-erode-rights/
The details of this treaty:
http://www.parentalrights.org/index.asp?Type=B_BASIC&SEC={B56D7393-E583-4658-85E6-C1974B1A57F8}
mountainsong 02.25.09 at 1:47 pm
Why isn’t Raines in jail? And Madoff? And Stanford? And Bush/Cheney? Obama should be in jail, not the WhiteHouse.
girlsrule 02.25.09 at 1:47 pm
In reference to #127…..click on “20 things you must know about CRC”
jenniforhillary 02.25.09 at 1:50 pm
I think blaming the banks is HOGWASH to some extent. First, the GOVMENT said they HAD TO LOAN money to people who were bad risks. So, whose fault are perhaps 75% of the failed mortgages…the people who signed on the dotted line and the GOVMENT. Sure, banks need some help in the good business/morality department but I have friends who OWN banks and I can DAMN WELL PROMISE you that they would not have made NOT A ONE of those loans unless the DEMOCRAPS and the black caucus said they had to. It was bad business from the get go and that is what happens when the GOVMENT tells business what it HAS TO DO in spite of the fact that history and common sense will tell you that it was going to be BIG BAD FAILURE!!
Things we could do to stimulate ecomony that wouldn’t cost or cost a little: Get rid of capital gains tax until economy improves (this would free up cash and people could start selling and spending), tax incentives or breaks for companies that hire Americans/buy American, lower all mortgages to 4% across board on good credit risks….
just a start people…but these plans don’t cost 80000000 million trillion and some pretty smart economists thing they would be good idea!
PUMAbear 02.25.09 at 1:54 pm
Since African-Americans seem to be held accountable for the destruction of our economy, even reaching bacK to 1977 to blame banks who were “forced” to make loans. Read the history of housing discrimination and government mandated “redlining. And don’t forget America was also “forced” to give AAs citizenship, voting rights and access to education and public accomodations.
indigogo 02.25.09 at 1:55 pm
bmw60 02.25.09 at 1:46 pm #128
The posting of this personal information without (or even with!) attribution is wrong!
I live in that county; what do you think you are doing to a private citizen?
Murphy, please remove this post?
KerryLINY 02.25.09 at 1:56 pm
The economy is not broken because of bad loans and foreclosures (which right now is less than 10% of all mortgages) but because of the leverage that resulted from those mortgages. Products were devised by wall street with leverages of greater than 30:1. This became possible due to the deregulation of wall street (mostly Graham’s work). Thus a bad situation became catastrophic as an uptick in foreclosures resulted in 30 times its effect compared to a sane era in which puffed up and downright fraudulent leveraged practices was not legalized on Wall street.
This is again a DC game (mostly employed from the right) in which the powerful point the finger at the less privileged – whose chattering class drink it up time and again. This mess is from wall street aided by DC. The folks on main street and the poor alone would not have brought forth this debacle because they took on collaterized mortgages alone.
bmw60 02.25.09 at 1:59 pm
INTERESTING HOW THE MILITARY MEN ARE QUESTIONING OBAMA’S RIGHT TO BE PRESIDENT:
http://defendourfreedoms.us/2009/02/25/another-active-duty-officer-joins-military-action.aspx?results=1#SurveyResultsChart
BillieJo 02.25.09 at 2:01 pm
What does it really matter if we come up with the answer to the economy crisis and how to get out of it for the US?
The government doesn’t listen to us anyway……..they have their own agenda!
The only power we have is:
1- To run and win an office in the senate or house…yea, like any of us have the money that is needed to pay to play.
2- Refuse to pay our Federal taxes until enough people do it together to make the Feds notice us
3- Wait until the election and vote all the Fcukers out of office!
mountainsong 02.25.09 at 2:01 pm
Just because the “government” tells us we have to do something doesn’t mean we have to. We always have a choice. It’s called free will.
indigogo 02.25.09 at 1:55 pm I agree.
PUMAbear 02.25.09 at 1:54 pm I don’t know where you are oming from, but WHERE on THIS blog has anyone ever blamed AA’s for the mess the country is in?
Maybe it’s really native americans fault for not exploiting this land in the first place.
jenniforhillary 02.25.09 at 2:01 pm
Kery…that is an excellent synthesis of the issues. I would just argue that bad mortgages is a problem because these people also need health/medical/etc. but it is a SYSTEM FAILURE from top down and everyone needs to get in line for a whipping and a do-over.
jenniforhillary 02.25.09 at 2:02 pm
health/food/and other services…
nativegirl 02.25.09 at 2:03 pm
jenniforhillary 02.25.09 at 1:26 pm
…. thank you…….
bmw60 02.25.09 at 2:03 pm
Kerry… I beg to differ with you.. ACORN demonstrated in Banks so the banks could not carry on business and at the homes of Bank Presidents. The Feds back in Clinton’s time mandated that banks make these bad loans… now we bail them out again? I mean the ones who got the mortgages that caused the banking crisis to begin with. With no regulation given to Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac who held most of these mortgages… AIG insuring those mortgages… They caused this collapse of the system… all started when the idea that everyone is “entitled” to have a home….
AND GEORGE BUSH AND MCCAIN TRIED TO DO SOMETHING ABOUT FANNIE MAE AND FREDDIE MAC AND THE DAMN DEMOCRATIC CONGRESS WOULD NOT DO A THING!!!
SO THERE IS ENOUGH BLAME TO GO AROUND!!
I love Rick Santelli… since when did owning a home become a “right” in this country. Since when did make sense or best question of all… IS IT GUARANTEED IN THE CONSTITUTION???
taggles1 02.25.09 at 2:06 pm
They Warned Us About the Mortgage Crisis
State whistleblowers tried to curtail greedy lending—and were thwarted by the Bush Administration and the financial industry
http://www.businessweek.com/magazine/content/08_42/b4104036827981.htm?chan=magazine+channel_in+depth
5 page article, too much info to post, but good reading if you want to understand how the Bush Admin was in bed with the Wall Street.
bmw60 02.25.09 at 2:06 pm
Better yet indigogo……. go visit her and see if the information is valid.
bmw60 02.25.09 at 2:07 pm
BYE… see ya in a week… sheesh
mountainsong 02.25.09 at 2:09 pm
bmw60 02.25.09 at 2:06 pm If it’s fair to post all that woman’s private information here, would you mind posting all of yours so she can at least see who posted hers?
webfoot 02.25.09 at 2:09 pm
What Obama Could Have Said
by murphy on February 25, 2009
—————————————————————–
Speechless, I am absolutely speechless. You have an incredible grasp of economics Murphy.
indigogo 02.25.09 at 2:10 pm
bmw60 02.25.09 at 2:06 pm #143
Better yet indigogo……. go visit her and see if the information is valid.
———————-
Nothing could make me intrude upon another person’s privacy in such a manner.
mountainsong 02.25.09 at 2:10 pm
Who knows? Maybe our Murphy will become the first female POTUS!! Anything is possible, so they say.
jenniforhillary 02.25.09 at 2:10 pm
pumabear….I did not say that. I said that a Democratically controlled Congress under a Democratic president with the assistance of the Black Caucus devised a plan for DISASTER that involved forcing (FORCING) banks to give loans to people who could not handle them, would never pay them back, and would end in disaster saying that RACISM was the only reason the banks were not loaning money to these people in the first place.
I did NOT say that Black people killed the economy. In fact, I will say for the record that STUPID and GREEDY people killed the economy. But, going back to the loans for people who don’t make enough money, have bad credit, and a history of failing to keep their word THIS I do not support and it was pushed through and FORCED on banks because the Democrats said the ONLY reason these people were not given loans was because of RACISM. And this was not true. MANY, if not most, of these people were not given loans because they were and ARE bad risks.
As late as 1970 women could not get loans. In 1980 a friend of mine who is a woman was treated like shit at her bank because she was not married. WOMEN are GREAT risks, but sexism made it very hard for us to get loans.
Redlining is a real problem, but bad risks (and yes more black people may be bad risks than others and this may have something to do with generational welfare combined with racism but that STILL does not mean we should throw money at a problem knowing money alone will NEVER fix the real problem) and forcing banks to make bad loans is not going to fix the problem. We have some REAL social problems in some communities and they must be dealt with before money will be able to help.
I think that people like YOU and me could devise a plan that may work, but the dems didn’t do this. not at all.
But hell no I am not blaming blacks people for killing the economy….
Delle 02.25.09 at 2:15 pm
Murphy for POTUS.
I second that!
Delle
indigogo 02.25.09 at 2:18 pm
jenniforhillary 02.25.09 at 2:10 pm #149
pumabear….I did not say that. I said that a Democratically controlled Congress under a Democratic president with the assistance of the Black Caucus devised a plan for DISASTER that involved forcing (FORCING) banks to give loans to people who could not handle them, would never pay them back, and would end in disaster saying that RACISM was the only reason the banks were not loaning money to these people in the first place.
—————————
Now that I’ve waded in……..
Jenniforhillary – I agree with you ……. But …….. wasn’t the intent of that program to help people who would otherwise not be able to afford home ownership (always lauded as the most American of dreams)? And then, weren’t those people who bought into the dream exploited by those who sold them more than they could afford?
We need to help PEOPLE! Not corporations or banks!
PUMAbear 02.25.09 at 2:21 pm
Mountainsong, perhaps you’ve been away but many references have been made to the Jimmy Cater CRA from 1977 and the black causu forcing banks to make loans to tu th undeserving. Guess who that is?
If you don’t know the history of lending discrimination in the US maybe someone could bother to look up the facts from a *credible* source.
Real estate loans to. AAs have been moved to subprime markets even when the borrower has the same income and credit rating as a white. This is a fact. Homes in AA neighborhoods are often undervalued to deny loans and refis.
Sometimes people may not have 20 percent down but the FHA has been making these loans for generation if insurance is added.
African Americans received about 40 pc of those FM loans most of which charge AAs unscrupulous interest, fees, prepayment penalties of more than $10000.
scarlet 02.25.09 at 2:24 pm
taggles1 02.25.09 at 2:06 pm
They Warned Us About the Mortgage Crisis
State whistleblowers tried to curtail greedy lending—and were thwarted by the Bush Administration and the financial industry
http://www.businessweek.com/magazine/content/08_42/b4104036827981.htm?chan=magazine+channel_in+depth
5 page article, too much info to post, but good reading if you want to understand how the Bush Admin was in bed with the Wall Street.
———–
Thanks Taggles.
KerryLINY 02.25.09 at 2:25 pm
jenniforhillary 02.25.09 at 2:01 pm 138
We are in agreement on that.
It was a house of cards
- interest rates getting cur continuously to stimulate growth in 2001-2006 (when there was recovery no cut back, still the same senseless spending, accumulation of deficits, and war spending that are not accounted for in the budge).
- low interest rates combined with subprime fuel housing boom. since we were manufacturing less and less and more factories and jobs shipped oiverseas, the housing market was the only action area during the Bush time. Everyone because a real estate agent and home improvement expert.
- flipping of houses and speculations gest added to the problem. speculation was not because of fannie, freddie or subprime but poor oversight and loose rules. the rich folks were the flippers and speculators.
Even as bad as that scenario is this would not have been enough to bring down the economy. Enter the multiplir effect.:
- mortgage backed products were devised and sold and resold until leverages went as high as 20 to 1 and greater (based on Phil Gramm’s work).
- boom bursts.
- slight tick in mortgage defaults (still less than 10%) result in recalling of products based on those defaults with a thirty fold effect on wall street which resulted in credit freeze, then loss of jobs, then more defaults. Now of that small uptick in mortgage defaults a good portion is by regular old mortggages and only a small portion is due to suprime (those the governemnt forced). Even less of this number is due to Acorn and balck communities still. Is there blame along the pyramid yes but the reason why it had a crash land is due to the leverage and lack of regulation and oversight. This is simply the truth. Are there smaller truths that contributed? Yes – subrprime, fannie, freddie and government home ownership drives for the less privileged. Blaming our debacle on that is like going after the poor begger that dipped a hand through the car window to grab oranges off your dashboard while a rich man is actually making off with the entire car.
We cant let republicans and the rich sell than subprime is the WHOLE cause lie. I dont care if both parties get the blame as I have no dog in either side of that fight. Ordinarily, mortgages being based on collaterals would result in only a slight reduction in bank’s book values in a non-fraudulent, better regulated, sane environment.
bmw60 02.25.09 at 2:25 pm
HOPE IT WAS REMOVED… SORRY… DIDN’T THINK ABOUT THE PERSONAL STUFF BUT THE FACT THAT OBAMA’S MOTHER HAD THE SAME SS# AND SHOULD BE INVESTIGATED… PLEASE REMOVE MURPHY…
HMMM Maybe this information will be of benefit to us all to read how the fascists around the world take hold of a country… a history lesson to see if it relates to what is happening today?????
http://www.resistnet.com/forum/topics/modern-leftism-as-recycled?xgs=1
AND THEN THERE’S A TEA PARTY IN ARIZONA:
Dear Arizona Taxpayer:
Join the Arizona chapter of Americans for Prosperity (AFP), allied pro-taxpayer organizations, and hundreds of activists for an Arizona Taxpayer Tea Party, this Friday, February 27, at noon at the Tempe Beach Park to protest (and stop) the tax increases proposed by big-spending politicians at the federal, state, and local levels. Wally the (Empty) Taxpayer Wallet will also be in attendance.Two weeks ago, AFP delivered to Congress over 430,000 names of Americans who signed AFP’s NoStimulus.com petition. The liberals in Washington went ahead and passed the Spendulus package, but American taxpayers are now mobilized for the next fight.
And there are plenty of fights coming.
Obama, Pelosi and Reid are continuing the Bush-Paulson tradition of using your tax dollars to bail out people who got themselves into bad mortgages.
Gov. Jan Brewer and the majority in the Arizona Legislature have held firm thus far against raising taxes to fix the gigantic state deficit caused by over-spending. They are, however, taking heavy political flak from the spending lobbies and newspaper editors, and will need our help during the budget battles in the coming weeks.
Meanwhile, cash-hungry local politicians are raising property tax levies.
Join us in sending a powerful message to the politicians, special interests, and the mainstream media by taking part in the Arizona Taxpayer Tea Party.
Our initial meetup will be at 11:45 a.m. at the Tempe Beach Park, west of the Mill Avenue Bridge. A parking lot is available next to the park, on Rio Salado Parkway.
Map: http://phoenix.about.com/library/blmaptempebeachpark.htm
Please let us know you will attend by sending an email to infoAZ@afphq.org.
18th-century attire welcome. Tar and feathers optional.
For Liberty,
Tom Jenney
Arizona Director
Americans for Prosperity
jenniforhillary 02.25.09 at 2:25 pm
no indigo..Banks do not give away money. The point of the program and the legality of the program rested on the fact that the ONLY reason these people were being denied credit to purchase homes was racism.
This is an example of being doing dumb things to be politically correct. Because it was NOT simply racism in a majority of the cases, rules had to be relaxed to the point of ridiculousness and in the end ANYONE could basically get a loan, with no money down, bad credit,and no income check.
Many people make BAD money decisions. Rims, grills, and cell phones are some of them. Alcohol and drugs and fast food are another. Too many children, dropping out of school, and generational welfare are some more. These people, when given money, do NOT spend it wisely because they do not understand what that means. They have NEVER had to be responsible (i.e. welfare, section 8, free food, free electric, free gifts at the holidays, free medical) so why in the world would we expect them to be responsible now.
We have created this monster because of Racism and not thinking poor people count. But this monster will not be satisfied with money. Instead, we have to rehabilitate the monster starting with ourselves and start investing in poor children. NOT money per se but good schools and GOOD parenting and I will shut my mouth because you won’t like what I am going to say next…
Throwing money at poor people does not make them not poor nor does it help their children. I have been in the streets, I have worked here…I know what I am talking about.
And for the record poor crosses all gender and race lines. Poor is just poor.
Pat Johnson 02.25.09 at 2:26 pm
The damage has been done. The issue is in trying to find a way out of it. We can sit here for day playing ping pong trying to figure out who is to blame but it gets us nowhere. I think the fairest thing to do is to help the individual homeowner. Each case is different from the next.
Two years ago, my paid off home was worth over $200,000. All on paper. It seems that the banks should consider lowering interest rates and perhaps re-evalulating at a fair market level. This might help. And if it means the stockholders end up with less, so be it.
Taggles seems to be reaching out and asking others to ring in with solutions. She has made it clear that she is not interested in listening to Repub talking points or “outing” addresses of other people. Get a grip!
As for torture, we do it, we have done it, and it appears that we will continue to do it. It is wrong on every level and there is no justification for it. As a nation we should bow our heads in shame that this practice is continued. It is an excuse to recharge the barbarism that dwells amidst us all and waits only for the opportunity to practice. Don’t believe it? One only need to view a sports event and watch them attempt to maim the other side.
We should accept no excuses in our name. We merely strip our own humanity.
KerryLINY 02.25.09 at 2:26 pm
“interest rates getting cut continuously” – if my spelling can be salvaged in above comment
bmw60 02.25.09 at 2:27 pm
Kerry… this talk about the rich and the poor makes me sick… sheesh talk about the Politics of Envy!
jenniforhillary 02.25.09 at 2:28 pm
kerry, I agree with every single thing you have just said. And yes flippers/investors/shady realtors (who might also be part of flippers/investors) are absolutely to blame for a big part of the problem….
taggles1 02.25.09 at 2:28 pm
jenniforhillary 02.25.09 at 1:26 pm
Number 1 and 2
I am not talking about normal everyday moderate republicans, but the Republican Party.
Number 3 and 4
If Democrats are just as bad as Republicans, why do so many PUMA’s sound like Republicans who just read the Republican disseminated talking points for the day?
Your Summary
If Democrats and Republicans are the same, don’t you think they both want to feather their own nest.
You are reading not reading what I am writing. I do not think the Democrats have the great ideas, I am not an obot, although I have been accused of it which is quite hilarious. I am not a Bushbot or member of the Republican Party either.
Also, I have educated myself on all of the reason this economy has gone to shit. I wish you would as well, instead of just reiterating Republican talking points. You are much smarter than that. You have stated in your own words that they are no good either, so what gives?
mountainsong 02.25.09 at 2:29 pm
Well, I DO remember my Mother being one of the first women in our town to have a car. Even so, she needed my Father’s signature to buy it.
Being half native american, I sympathize with the plight of AA’s in America. But please~~~stop whinning about it~~~It solves nothing.
jenniforhillary 02.25.09 at 2:31 pm
but if Americans–poor, middle class, and rich–don’t stop thinking Govment will save them and start being responsible they will NOT demand responsiblity on the part of others ESPECIALLY politicians…
I think the whole mindset of America needs to change and we need to think about working together and holding everyone accountable. EVERYONE.
And I am always impressed with the intelligence and compassion at Puma….and the cross section of america I see here…
and murphy, who rocks it always and forever!
taggles1 02.25.09 at 2:32 pm
Jenni,
How is demanding something that will help the people the antithesis of what you are saying.
I want to demand they help us, not the god damned banks and fat cat wall streeters.
mountainsong 02.25.09 at 2:32 pm
Most everyone alive can find some reason to sit on the pity-pot, but all it does is bring everyone around them down.
Alot of the time I disagree with Taggles, but each is entitled to their own opinion and I really appreciate her call for SOLUTIONS this morning.
Pat Johnson 02.25.09 at 2:32 pm
“We” had nothing to do with this mess. “We” were busy trying to get on with our own daily lives to have much interest in just what the banks and the mortgage interest was doing to fatten their own wallets.
The fault was the lack of oversight and degregulation which allowed this industry to take unheard of risks that most of us are unable to wrap our minds around.
The fault for much of these moves rests with the overwhelming and creeping insidious brought about my corporate interests who could care less about you and me. Their power is overwhelming and their tentacles are everywhere. Saying that “we” are to blame overall is a misconception they are only too eager to wrap us in. Monopolies rule, greed it the factor, and those who take the money to look the other way are the reasons we are where we are.
jenniforhillary 02.25.09 at 2:33 pm
taggles..I am reading as much as I can. And I neither think you are an obot or unintelligent. I just think you sound like a democrat….
I love you dearly and respect you. I just am frustrated.
email me a reading list. please.
mountainsong 02.25.09 at 2:34 pm
jenniforhillary 02.25.09 at 2:31 pm
“I think the whole mindset of America needs to change and we need to think about working together and holding everyone accountable. EVERYONE.”
ABSOfuckingLUTELY!!!
KerryLINY 02.25.09 at 2:37 pm
Pat Johnson 02.25.09 at 2:26 pm
The damage has been done. The issue is in trying to find a way out of it.
————–
I agree with you that finding the solution is key and was about to say it is important not to have the cause misrepresented or not understood or we might end up with the wrong solutions or the prepetrators posing as problem solvers. then you go and join us in the blame analysis
(Pat Johnson 02.25.09 at 2:32 pm). I dont think this is blame perse though but a need to understand what happened clearly.
FLBarbara 02.25.09 at 2:38 pm
Taggles1
I do not believe most Americans are against helping a neighbour in need. Just the opposite we are a generous people. Take a look at the money raised for families of 911 or Katrina.
But most Americans can take a look at their neighbours and see those that deserve to be helped by us and those who are well taking advantage of us.
Just a few of my neighbours in FL that consist of those who bought 4 Condos at over inflated prices to begin with in the Hope values would continue to rise. They bought no money down and when the real estate market began to tank in FL 2 years ago they walked away or many rented their condos for 3,500- 5,000 a month but did not make mortgage payments.
Pocketed the money.
Then we have my neighbour who bought 2 condos, with no money down and no job at the time,took out home equity loans every time her condos appreciated which in FL was daily, she used the money from her home equity loans to pay her mortgages when the equity dried up she could not pay her mortgages and went to sell but she borrowed more than the property is now worth. So she lives in one free and a sister lives in the another. She wonders how a bank lent her 800,000 for mortgages and 200,00 in equity when she did not have a job? Never questioned that until the bottom fell out.
Then I have the neighbour who bought his condo to live in and put 20 percent down and paid his mortgage until he lost his job 6 months ago. He can not sell because he bought at over inflated prices and he will owe money when he sells. .
So who do you feel needs the help?
And can you see the anger in my neighbourhood from those of us who were not greedy and struggle to deal with the mess created in not only Fl but this country?
They watch Acorn breaking into homes that have been fore closed because mortgages weren’t paid from day one, listened to a Acorn woman say it is a constitution right to own a house.WTF?
.This has been going on in FL for over 3 years.and it is hard to feel compassion for those who believe they are entitled to be bailed out by me.
When they made poor choices.
girlsrule 02.25.09 at 2:44 pm
bmw60 #128…..where did you find this information? I am curious as well about what you posted. If you do find the link, please post it here, I will look as well
PUMAbear 02.25.09 at 2:44 pm
Jennifer4hillary,
You seem wedded to you sterotype of AA borrowers mostly with their cadillacs, alcohol, cell phones, you probably don’t know many AA homeowners but plenty have pretty well paying traditional jobs, and don’t abuse alcohol. Many can pay on a normal loan but not a devious or usurous one. AAs have little accumulated or inherited wealth due to generations of low pay, job discrimination, migrating from the south where they were unable to vote or get an education.
So if you have a source for your assertion that AA homeowners have moral failures and drinking promlems I’d like to see it.
Pat Johnson 02.25.09 at 2:44 pm
We can blame ourselves for some of what has taken place but when you are continually presented candidates from both parties that are mediocre at best, and are then asked to make a choice as to which one promises to do the least damage, you have already lost. Big time.
Obama never should have even gotten through the primaries let alone get elected to office. But the MSM was his biggest booster. Why? Because of the laziness of the electorate. No one bothered to put his feet to the fire or ask the tough questions. Whose fault is that? Not the people on this blog.
McCain was yesterday’s news. Even his own party backed off from support. Is that our fault? Throwing a female candidate into the mix was a chess move, nothing more. Can’t have Hillary, then look over here!
We had once again 4 less than stellar performers to choose from. The best and most experienced, the one who would have been ready on Day One, was tossed to the curb leaving us with limited choices. Not our fault.
Having said that, we must be energized to look carefully once again at any candidate desirous of our support. Issues are important and if the answers are not satisfactory it is our duty to demand it otherwise.
But I refuse to buy into the collective “we”. This blog, and others like it, stood for something that never materialized. It is up to us to make it better.
KerryLINY 02.25.09 at 2:48 pm
jenniforhillary 02.25.09 at 2:31 pm
well said jenni!
I will add one little qualifier though: it would help if government does not sit idly by (its their jobs to police things and make sure fair rules are kept since we cant do this also ourselves) or make rules that allow the collective house we call our country to be pundered leaving us holding the bag. if it had been left to us and our mortgage defaulting alone without their 30 times leverages we’d still be ok today. if they did not spend us into a deficit while giving away money to trickle down to us as jobs but which ended up in foreign investments and job overseas at cheaper labor markets, emerging markets with better yields (gee who thought the rich would so patriotically invest their tax cuts here if they have better yield elsewhere) we’d also probably be a bit better today.
I hope i dont sound democratic because both sides are deplorable. it’s just that we are coming out of the past 8 years and it was bad government from predominantly one ideaological side that prevailed in derailing us mostly and the bad ideas of the other side started it off even earlier and is already on track to making it seriously worse right now.
Pat Johnson 02.25.09 at 2:51 pm
I am not saying that we overlook the cause. I am saying that the solution is the most dominant feature of where we are right now. Regulation and oversight are badly needed. Right now the barn door is open. We can seek the discovery of the failure in time.
People are hurting. They are scared of the future. There must be a way to ease that burden which should be the first step in seeking a solution. It is the job of the lawmakers to cap the cause. But first things first.
kat in your hat 02.25.09 at 2:51 pm
I missed the whole O thing. Went out. Besides, I can barely put up with watching him.
I just read this, thought it was a shame:
“Photographer Annie Leibovitz pawns her life’s work for a £10m loan to pay her mortgage” http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1155053/Photographer-Annie-Leibovitz-pawns-lifes-work-10m-loan-pay-mortgage.html
kat in your hat 02.25.09 at 2:54 pm
Jake Tapper: Obama Claims He Has “Accomplished More in 30 Days Than Any President in Modern History”
http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/2009/02/25/jake-tapper-obama-claims-he-has-accomplished-more-in-30-days-than-any-president-in-modern-history/
indigogo 02.25.09 at 2:55 pm
jenniforhillary 02.25.09 at 2:25 pm #156
no indigo..Banks do not give away money. The point of the program and the legality of the program rested on the fact that the ONLY reason these people were being denied credit to purchase homes was racism.
———————————
Banks do loan money when they are asked to do so by real estate agents (unscrupulous or otherwise); if the agents vouched for the person asking for the loan, then wouldn’t the bank loan the money? I don’t think it was racism; I think it was more classism – realtors wanting to make a buck regardless of the poor profile of the person to whom they were lending.
KerryLINY 02.25.09 at 2:55 pm
Pat Johnson 02.25.09 at 2:44 pm
McCain was yesterday’s news. Even his own party backed off from support. Is that our fault? Throwing a female candidate into the mix was a chess move, nothing more. Can’t have Hillary, then look over here!
———–
Is there no turth more obvious. Even he now says he might not support her in 2012! And she was the best choice just last year? How did she lose value overyear? What an insult to our intelligence! Dont get me riled up. Like were some fools or what. Now McCain’s failing are not hers necessarily and that tactic is not her fault in any way.
mountainsong 02.25.09 at 2:57 pm
kat in your hat 02.25.09 at 2:54 pm Well, he’s certainly TALKED more than any other president in history.
I think he might have come from Area 51.
taggles1 02.25.09 at 2:58 pm
scarlet 02.25.09 at 2:24 pm [edit]
taggles1 02.25.09 at 2:06 pm
They Warned Us About the Mortgage Crisis
State whistleblowers tried to curtail greedy lending—and were thwarted by the Bush Administration and the financial industry
http://www.businessweek.com/magazine/content/08_42/b4104036827981.htm?chan=magazine+channel_in+depth
5 page article, too much info to post, but good reading if you want to understand how the Bush Admin was in bed with the Wall Street.
———–
Thanks Taggles.
________________________
you are welcome Scarlet!
kat in your hat 02.25.09 at 3:00 pm
OT/ Woman-lynching:
South Dade dad kills wife, 2 daughters and himself; son escapes
http://www.miamiherald.com/news/breaking-news/story/920801.html
PUMAbear 02.25.09 at 3:07 pm
Why are repubs at this site screeching about Obama when they applauded during the eight years the repubs robbed the nation and tried to lock up the Clintons for anything from lying to murder? And they didn’tsay a word when Bush cheated TWICE!!
So who cares what you think now creating conflict so you can grab the reins again I 2010?
Pfft.
Pat Johnson 02.25.09 at 3:12 pm
I loathe the current Dem leadership and the DNC which assisted in severing me from my own party. But to jump into the laps of the Repubs based solely on disseffection toward Obama is foolish.
Like trying to insist that cyanide is better for you than arsenic. Ludicrous!
BillieJo 02.25.09 at 3:18 pm
PUMAbear – So who cares what you think now creating conflict so you can grab the reins again in 2010?
Pfft.
————
Yup, Pfft!!!!!
All the cat fights begin with the mention of Bush, Rove, Ray-gun and the other Republican heros.
Let’s not put ethics and these folks in the same sentence, let’s not even mention them…
Neither party has any ethics today…just a few good women and less good men.
Pat Johnson 02.25.09 at 3:21 pm
Billie Jo: Yep.
PUMAbear 02.25.09 at 3:24 pm
Billiejo,
Right. I thought I had a party that stood for something. And by golly maybe it will again if we keep fighting for what’s right.
BillieJo 02.25.09 at 3:30 pm
PUMAbear
I thought I had a party that stood for something. And by golly maybe it will again if we keep fighting for what’s right.
——
We will keep fighting but wonder if O’jackass is gonna bring politics to a whole new low despite our efforts.
bmw60 02.25.09 at 3:47 pm
So…. here’s an example of one that wants a bailout:
Media Sob Story: Poor Bus Driver Faces Foreclosure & Wants Bailout– Can’t Afford $800,000 Home (Video)
Mainstream Media Sob Story of the Day–
Poor distressed homeowner and bus driver Minta Garcia says she was taken advantage of when she bought her $800,000 home. She says the banks made it too easy for her to buy the home.
Those dirty dogs!
Now Minta is asking Dear Leader for help.
Unreal.
CNN reported:
The American people really need to bail out Minta on her $800,000 mortgage.
Please increase your payroll deductions now to help this suffering family!
Thank you.
Hat Tip M. Smith
pigpaws 02.25.09 at 3:56 pm
How politics works: Senator Dodd and his cozy Irish cottage
http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/toby_harnden/blog/2009/02/24/how_politics_works_senator_christopher_dodd_and_his_cosy_irish_cottage
admin 02.25.09 at 3:57 pm
Boo-hoo-hoo, poor widdle banksters shouldnt be forced to live on $500,000 a year. It’s HARD to live in Manhattan on half a million, the Republicans are going to have to put a stop to this and make sure that the taxpayers pay for Mr and Mrs MegaBank to afford their household staff, private tuitions, and ski trips to Aspen. Using taxpayer dollars to protect Mr and Mrs Bankster is PATRIOTIC FREE MARKET AMERICAN VALUES doggonit!
“PRIVATE school: $32,000 a year per student.
Mortgage: $96,000 a year.
Co-op maintenance fee: $96,000 a year.
Nanny: $45,000 a year.
We are already at $269,000, and we haven’t even gotten to taxes yet.
Five hundred thousand dollars — the amount President Obama wants to set as the top pay for banking executives whose firms accept government bailout money — seems like a lot, and it is a lot. To many people in many places, it is a princely sum to live on. But in the neighborhoods of New York City and its suburban enclaves where successful bankers live, half a million a year can go very fast.
-snip-
Barbara Corcoran, a real estate executive, said that most well-to-do families take at least two vacations a year, a winter trip to the sun and a spring trip to the ski slopes.
Total minimum cost: $16,000.
A modest three-bedroom apartment, she said, which was purchased for $1.5 million, not the top of the market at all, carries a monthly mortgage of about $8,000 and a co-op maintenance fee of $8,000 a month. Total cost: $192,000. A summer house in Southampton that cost $4 million, again not the top of the market, carries annual mortgage payments of $240,000.
Many top executives have cars and drivers. A chauffeur’s pay is between $75,000 and $125,000 a year, the higher end for former police officers who can double as bodyguards, said a limousine driver who spoke anonymously because he does not want to alienate his society customers.
“Some of them want their drivers to have guns,” the driver said. “You get a cop and you have a driver.” To garage that car is about $700 a month.
A personal trainer at $80 an hour three times a week comes to about $12,000 a year.
The work in the gym pays off when one must don a formal gown for a charity gala. “Going to those parties,” said David Patrick Columbia, who is the editor of the New York Social Diary (newyorksocialdiary.com), “a woman can spend $10,000 or $15,000 on a dress. If she goes to three or four of those a year, she’s not going to wear the same dress.”
Total cost for three gowns: about $35,000.”
read it and weep for the poor banksters who those unAmerican lefties want to stop us from helping.
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/02/08/fashion/08halfmill.html
bmw60 02.25.09 at 4:03 pm
Web link for above story:
http://gatewaypundit.blogspot.com/2009/02/media-sob-story-poor-bus-driver-faces.html
taggles1 02.25.09 at 4:03 pm
What fuckin idiot put us in this position by giving Minta the BUS DRIVER an 800,000 dollar loan????
How about the banks that are suppose to protect our investment in them?
It’s like letting the guy who robbed Fort Knox off and prosecuting the guy who picked up a couple of the dollars that dropped out the get away car for 1st Degree Bank Robbery.
bmw60 02.25.09 at 4:05 pm
And Murphy…. sorry, but sounds like the Politics of Envy…
Sheesh when is that going to stop… if you were a CEO of a company and they offered you a Million dollars or more a year, which of you wouldn’t do it? Tell me now…
bmw60 02.25.09 at 4:07 pm
Which one of us would have taken out an 800,000 dollar mortgage to begin with Taggles?
Sheesh… where is the personal responsibility!
DancesWithPumas 02.25.09 at 4:08 pm
kat in your hat 02.25.09 at 2:54 pm
Jake Tapper: Obama Claims He Has “Accomplished More in 30 Days Than Any President in Modern History”
——————-
I don;t know what oblowyerself has accomplished aside from giving a trillion dollars of borrowed money away…to people the effing govt were being paid to regulate.
Let the entire pyramid scheme hit bottom… flush… and begin anew.
indigogo 02.25.09 at 4:09 pm
Great post, Murphy! I like this part:
“Sure, the solution may seem simple: move to Brooklyn or Hoboken, put the children in public schools and buy a MetroCard. But more than a few of the New York-based financial executives who would have their pay limited are men (and they are almost invariably men) whose identities are entwined with living a certain way in a certain neighborhood west of Third Avenue: a life of private schools, summer houses and charity galas that only a seven-figure income can stretch to cover.
Few are playing sad cellos over the fate of such folk, especially since the collapse of the institutions they run has yielded untold financial pain. But in New York, where a new study from the Center for an Urban Future, a nonprofit research group in Manhattan, estimates it takes $123,322 to enjoy the same middle-class life as someone earning $50,000 in Houston, extricating oneself from steep bills can be difficult. ”
Give me a break! I live on Social Security alone (disability) at the age of 51; have for 3 years now.
My difference with PUMAs is that I believe in Obama – and I love Hillary too. I am so glad that both of them are in control of the reigns of government. I have nothing but respect for the both of them.
taggles1 02.25.09 at 4:10 pm
OMG!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!
ROFLMAO!!!!!
WTF?!?!?!?
DancesWithPumas 02.25.09 at 4:11 pm
My difference with PUMAs is that I believe in Obama
————-
On what is your belief in obama based?
DancesWithPumas 02.25.09 at 4:11 pm
LOL taggles !!! ditto
taggles1 02.25.09 at 4:12 pm
I am literally fuckin speechless.
Therefore the acronyms!
DancesWithPumas 02.25.09 at 4:13 pm
::: cehecking url to make sure I’m in the right place:::
bmw60 02.25.09 at 4:13 pm
THANKS PIGPAWS…. GREAT STORY THERE ABOUT CHRIS DODD… Purveyor of sub-prime mortgages through Fannie and Freddie, denying they needed oversight… now look at the 800,000 house this lady could buy…LOL
POLITICS OF ENVY HEAVY IN HERE TODAY!!!
Bye for now
admin 02.25.09 at 4:15 pm
Are you frackin serious bmw60? If I were the CEO of a bank that was partly respsonsible for the semi-collapse of the US economy I would expect to be FIRED! Never in a MILLION years would I expect the government to pay my paycheck of $5 MILLION dollars!
I dont expect the government to give ME anything — nothing, nada, zip. I expect the government to give me and all my neighbors good schools, good public utilities, safe streets, care for the elderly and the ill, clean drinking water, lighthouses, air traffic control, subways and public transportation, libraries, and the security of knowing that the medicines, food, and other products I buy with my own money are safe.
jesus christ, are you KIDDING me?
Politics of envy, my ass. I believe in the politics of Responsibility, Integrity, and Principles of Fairness and Transparency.
indigogo 02.25.09 at 4:15 pm
DancesWithPumas 02.25.09 at 4:11 pm #198
My difference with PUMAs is that I believe in Obama
————-
On what is your belief in obama based?
——————-
Do you want a real discussion, or just a chance to pile on?
DancesWithPumas 02.25.09 at 4:16 pm
I’ve been at appointments all day… what is everyone supposed to be envious of?
admin 02.25.09 at 4:16 pm
taggles: “What fuckin idiot put us in this position by giving Minta the BUS DRIVER an 800,000 dollar loan????
How about the banks that are suppose to protect our investment in them?
It’s like letting the guy who robbed Fort Knox off and prosecuting the guy who picked up a couple of the dollars that dropped out the get away car for 1st Degree Bank Robbery.”
genius.
mountainsong 02.25.09 at 4:17 pm
indigogo 02.25.09 at 4:09 pm You believe in Obama? Whatever happened to God?
kat in your hat 02.25.09 at 4:17 pm
It worked!
http://images.chron.com/blogs/txpotomac/Obama%20believe.jpg
http://www.moonbattery.com/obama-believe.jpg
BillieJo 02.25.09 at 4:17 pm
I thought this was a nobama site!
Respect for O’jackass……………..did you miss the primaries? Stealing an election with caucus fraud, ACORN unleashed is reason for respect?
DancesWithPumas 02.25.09 at 4:18 pm
indigogo 02.25.09 at 4:15 pm [edit]
DancesWithPumas 02.25.09 at 4:11 pm #198
My difference with PUMAs is that I believe in Obama
————-
On what is your belief in obama based?
——————-
Do you want a real discussion, or just a chance to pile on?
———-
I don’t want to discuss nor debate… I’m just curious, so I asked a direct question. Hoping for an answer.
admin 02.25.09 at 4:19 pm
thanks indigogo, but I did not write that. My own prose tends to be more repetitive and laced with words in ALL CAPS for maximum effect,
that was a story in the NYT from a couple weeks ago. The author clearly had his tongue in his cheek when he wrote it, but it was an informative article nonetheless.
mountainsong 02.25.09 at 4:19 pm
Whatever HAS become of this blog? Republicans and believers in Obama? WTF!!! Ok, I realize a mind is like a parachute~~~works best when it’s open….I’m good with that. But believing in Obama? HERE? How bout Bush? Reagan? Carter? Benedict Arnold? Or even THE Arnold? LMAO
Pat Johnson 02.25.09 at 4:20 pm
bmq60: I am not sure where you intend to go with these illustrations, but it is probably correct to mention that there are a group of morons out there who took advantage. But just who let them? The banks, the mortgage brokers, the real estate brokers who had the responsibility to prevent this abuse.
However, there are far more people out there who have lost their jobs, are soaked in healthcare expenses, whose kids need a roof over their heads. These are the majority.
You are beginning to sound like those who kept repeating the “welfare queen” meme to lump all recipients into one pile. It just ain’t so.
mountainsong 02.25.09 at 4:20 pm
Holy Crap!!!
I just looked out the window and it’s frickin SNOWING!!!
Pat Johnson 02.25.09 at 4:22 pm
Nah, just Jindal tearing up that awful speech he made last night.
BillieJo 02.25.09 at 4:22 pm
mountainsong
Whatever HAS become of this blog? Republicans and believers in Obama?
———–
Trolls should be in the dungeon. We get too distracted with this bs.
murphy 02.25.09 at 4:25 pm
exactly patJ and taggles, no rational person could dispute that a busdriver getting $800,000 in loans is an abuse of the system. No one here would argue that taxpayers should take over her insane debt.
Rational people conclude that though Minta may be deserving of scorn, she is not the root cause of the problem, AND trying to distract us from identifying the real culprits by throwing an embarrassing example of a person who absurdly overextended herself in our faces is NOT going to work.
We know who brought us to the brink of collapse, and it is NOT Minta Juarez.
DancesWithPumas 02.25.09 at 4:26 pm
“Rational people”
and therein lies the problem
DancesWithPumas 02.25.09 at 4:27 pm
indigogo
are you typing a response?
kat in your hat 02.25.09 at 4:30 pm
MSNBCer Says “Oh God” Before Jindal Response
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2009/02/msnbc_oh_god.html
(Chris Matthews says it was him.) lol–such crapheads.
PUMAbear 02.25.09 at 4:31 pm
BMW60.
Let me get this straight the politics of envy is when the poor and middle class object to the acqisition of obscene quantities of ill gotten gain.
- think it’s the politics of divisivness and contempt to all blame the have nots, who go wrong.
taggles1 02.25.09 at 4:33 pm
The cognitive dissonance is alarming!
Pat Johnson 02.25.09 at 4:35 pm
Not when you are single minded and your focus is simply bent on making a point that has little substance. Keep pushing. And pushing. And push it some more.
taggles1 02.25.09 at 4:35 pm
If only Minta was a wall street banker who managed to bilk 8 Billion rather than 8 hundred thousand………….
BigCatLover 02.25.09 at 4:35 pm
My difference with PUMAs is that I believe in Obama – and I love Hillary too. I am so glad that both of them are in control of the reigns of government. I have nothing but respect for the both of them.
************************************
This is a contradiction in terms!
mountainsong 02.25.09 at 4:36 pm
I have the answer!!!
Impeach Obama; Elect Murphy!!!!
mountainsong 02.25.09 at 4:37 pm
I DO believe in Murphy. The onlt thing I believe about Obama is that he’s living proof there are UFO’s and aliens from empty space.
BillieJo 02.25.09 at 4:40 pm
Okay, so the PorkPie is Joe’s baby.
Does that mean any funny business in the passing out of pork will be Joe’s fault and not O’jackass’?????????????
Say it ain’t so, Joe.
BigCatLover 02.25.09 at 4:42 pm
BillieJo 02.25.09 at 4:40 pm
That’s exactly how it is intended. Joe goes under the bus and Obama skates again.
Susie1945 02.25.09 at 4:44 pm
I am so sick of all this crap – we can bitch and complain all we want & it ain’t gonna make a single bit of difference – there is no such thing as any ‘honest politician’ – if you can find one let me know – our constitution means nothing – it’s being interpreted to enrich the already rich ratbastards in DC -
off topic – in honor of mardi gras, louisiana, boogie, pianos, whatever – here’s Ray Charles, Jerry Lee Lewis & Fats Domino together pounding the keys -
Enjoy – http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xe5w0_ray-charles-jerry-lee-lewis
henry 02.25.09 at 4:47 pm
I wonder how many nannies, drivers, personal assitants, maids are also provided with health insurance? My guess not many.
mountainsong 02.25.09 at 4:48 pm
I’m not sucking up~~~I just believe in equal rights and it’s someone else’s turn to do time in the dungeon.
AND……Murphy makes uncommon good sense!
BillieJo 02.25.09 at 4:49 pm
Okay, I’m bored so while searching for Blago news I ran across this……
Asshole still hasn’t gotten a dog for his kids………………..
What is the big fing deal finding a little dog?
WASHINGTON–President-elect Barack Obama revealed Sunday he is closing in on selecting the first dog — either a labradoodle or a Portuguese water hound. Here for one week, Obama and his family explored some of the city over the weekend.
The long-promised dog is a gift for daughters Malia and Sasha. “This has been tougher than finding a commerce secretary,” Obama told George Stephanopoulos
I am sure no link is required for this piece of fluff.
DancesWithPumas 02.25.09 at 4:49 pm
Susie1945 02.25.09 at 4:44 pm
I am so sick of all this crap – we can bitch and complain all we want & it ain’t gonna make a single bit of difference -
—————–
Basically, I agree …but, letting off steam is healthy, plus I’ve learned a lot about the genesis and evolution (apologies for the contradictory terms) of this fiscal crisis.
DeadGirl 02.25.09 at 4:53 pm
So… O’logo speaks… there was no way I was going to watch or listen to or read it or read about it… do lightning bolts still come outta his ass when he speaks???
Another great post Murphy…. sssssss giiirrrrL! you HOT!
DancesWithPumas 02.25.09 at 4:55 pm
indigogo
Still waiting.
BillieJo 02.25.09 at 4:55 pm
Dances
…but, letting off steam is healthy, plus I’ve learned a lot about the genesis and evolution (apologies for the contradictory terms) of this fiscal crisis.
——
There’s been enough steam letting on this blog to fuel NY city PG & E for an entire year.
Maybe we can call PUMApac the first green blog of the century.
KerryLINY 02.25.09 at 4:58 pm
I think indigogo stumbled into the wrong discussion. please come back after recovering from the koolaid coma. Anyone that “believes” in any politician is not yet ready to think for themselves.
taggles1 02.25.09 at 4:59 pm
BJ and Dances,
Whatever in the world are you talking about? LOL
indigogo 02.25.09 at 5:00 pm
mountainsong 02.25.09 at 4:20 pm #214
Holy Crap!!!
I just looked out the window and it’s frickin SNOWING!!!
—————-
Not yet here in Stanwood! I’ll keep an eye out!
You’re right, mountainsong, “believe” was too strong a word; I believe in a higher power. I just like Obama.
Murphy – I know those were not your words; I appreciated your quote from the NY times, that’s all!
Dances: I think what PUMA’s are doing re: women’s rights, new politics is right on. I understand your disappointment over Hillary not getting the nomination (she is an OUTSTANDING human being and woman and I am so grateful to have her at State; I would have been totally happy to vote for her as President). I really don’t understand why you can’t be for both Obama and Hillary (I see Hillary’s loss as more being outplayed politically rather than anything personal). I LOVE the Clintons – stood in line for 4 hours to have Bill sign his book for me at the U Bookstore and get a hug (the guy hugged EVERYONE! so cool!). But I also totally drank the koolaid, and believe in Obama’s intellect and message. My daughter, who is a 20 year old sophomore at the University of Washington, turned me on to him when she met him, at random, in the halls of the Hart building in 2006 when she was at a political leadership summer camp in Washington DC. He spent time with these youngsters, talking with them and answering their questions. Later, when we heard him speak two times in Seattle, we were impressed that he actually ASKED the youth to take responsibility for their lives and their community!
I have followed his career; read his books; I don’t think he is an empty suit; I think he appointed Hillary because he is smart – and so is she.
I do think that the fix was in for Hillary; you could tell because she was unsupported by the Democratic hierarchy (Pelosi, Dean, et al), and that they wanted Obama. Hillary had made too many enemies. (there’s a lot more we could talk about here)
Back to mountainsong’s question about belief: I believe Obama as President and Hillary as SOS is destiny; that it is good for the country and universe. I believe in Democratic principles; I think Murphy, taggles and many more of you PUMAs are true pioneers and trailblazers; I think I don;t understand why you tolerate Republican voices; I don’t understand why Republican voices are more welcome than Democratic voices who like both Obama and Hillary.
so, that’s a start. there are many viewpoints in the world; I am drawn to PUMAs because of your pro-woman world view; I don’t think that is incompatible with liking Obama.
Thanks for asking; I would be happy to continue the discussion – or not – it’s your world, your blog.
admin 02.25.09 at 5:02 pm
facts are such effective tools in an argument, doncha think?
Do Something posted, take it upstairs!
DancesWithPumas 02.25.09 at 5:03 pm
indigogo
Thank for your response.
BillieJo 02.25.09 at 5:03 pm
Hahaha, just found this on a Chicago website, O’jackass’ schedule for a day…besides all the fun events at night he has to be in many meetings a day. Harder than he has ever worked before…gettin’ up, going to meetings, having fun at night.
President Obama official schedule and guidance, Feb. 25, 2009. Stevie Wonder gets Gershwin Prize at the White House. Tony Bennett, Will.i.am others perform
http://blogs.suntimes.com/sweet/2009/02/president_obama_official_sched_17.html
We need a link to what he does every day to keep a watch on him, his every step. No ducking in to vote present now.
Bwahahahahaha!
DancesWithPumas 02.25.09 at 5:05 pm
I am drawn to PUMAs because of your pro-woman world view; I don’t think that is incompatible with liking Obama.
————-
Except that obama isn’t pro-women, and this is a NOBAMA blog.
nativegirl 02.25.09 at 5:07 pm
indigogo 02.25.09 at 5:00 pm
WOW… you really think your voice of “I believe in Obama” will be welcome here.. more than disenfranchised republican/independents AND Democrats???? We all have one thing in common here… we will do anything to NOT re-elect Obama, we did not vote for him, we will never vote for him. We may have differences.. but one thing is for sure, we are all in agreement… OBAMA SUCKS!! Sorry.. but I had to chime in..this is going to be entertaining….
KerryLINY 02.25.09 at 5:10 pm
My daughter, who is a 20 year old sophomore at the University of Washington, turned me on to him when she met him. – indi
—
Another child made me do it story! However, I have read BO’s books as well recently and dont think the guy is empty upstairs either – just that his policies are wrong for the country and he has not accomplished anything to arm him to take the reins he just took. I had to laugh at many other parts of your post – not trying to be mean.
PUMAbear 02.25.09 at 5:12 pm
Oblowme should appoint the labrapoodle second of commerce.
jenniforhillary 02.25.09 at 5:17 pm
pumabear…
Black people with jobs, good credit, some money down could get loans. So could Hispanics, Asians, American Indians, etc., etc., etc.
The people NOT able to get mortgages (for the most part) are people without good jobs, bad credit, and no money saved. THESE people are the ones the democrats and black caucus threw into the fray of “IT IS RACISM THAT IS KEEPING THESE PEOPLE FROM OWNING HOMES.”
ANd it most certainly is NOT. It is bad jobs, no credit and no money down. That is who I’m talking about. And it isn’t a black or white issue it’s a poor vs. rich. The Democrats/Black Caucus MADE IT A FUCKING RACE issue and then used it and they and their friends made a shitload of money off the whole mess.
That’s what i’m saying…
DancesWithPumas 02.25.09 at 5:17 pm
BillieJo 02.25.09 at 4:22 pm
mountainsong
Whatever HAS become of this blog? Republicans and believers in Obama?
———–
No kidding! I espcially love the republicans who say they were Pumas from the very beginning! as if…
LOL
HP Boston 02.25.09 at 8:00 pm
indigogo,
I had to laugh at all parts of your post – I AM trying to be mean.
Go suck up to Oblowby and ask him to pass the ERA, make yourself useful!
Illinois Gal 02.25.09 at 10:18 pm
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=7065205277695921912&ei=tnSQSfncNZCq-wHg_vX8CQ&q=zeitgeist&hl=en
Zeitgeist Addendum
This video is worth watching, especially the Federal Reserve Bank and how it controls our debt for profit. Unless we the people stop living on credit we will not be financially solvent. This video is a 2 hour video, but educational.
bmw60 02.26.09 at 4:00 pm
SHEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE’s Back….. Wow Indigogo.. you are a glutton for punishment… same comments you had on the blog yesterday… sounds like you are one of the Obots monitoring this site… sheesh what kind of fool am I to think that… sheesh I guess Obots think that its okay to say they support Hillary and Obama in the same sentence. I don’t think so…
but here is another site where citizens of this country want to Reclaim the USA and stop this government from taking us down the road to **(dare i say it SOCIALISM)**
http://www.fredomfirst.org
There will be meeting in Washington September 12th and 13th, 2009
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